John Velman | 5 May 2007 00:59
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Political syntax

Lately I've noticed quite often that a politician or bureaucrat says "I
never remember X" when he or she seems to want us to believe "I remember
that never X".  Why say "I never remember..." when "I don't remember X"
would do?

Is this an intentional ploy to give people the "I remember never.."
impression?  Or don't they deserve this much credit?

Best,

John Velman

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Robert Parks | 5 May 2007 06:22

Re: Political syntax

John,
Could you give a concrete example for analysis? Often the context helps to understand the possible motivations for odd syntax. One of the best analyses of political syntax is Kress and Hodge, Language as Ideology. Their key example was the use of passive voice in S. African newspapers after a demonstration in which police had opened fire on demonstrators. The headlines read "rioters killed in demonstration". Without mentioning an actor/agent who did the killing, it appears they simply died in the process of demonstrating, perhaps causing their own deaths by their choice to participate.

Bob

Lately I've noticed quite often that a politician or bureaucrat says "I
never remember X" when he or she seems to want us to believe "I remember
that never X".  Why say "I never remember..." when "I don't remember X"
would do?

Is this an intentional ploy to give people the "I remember never.."
impression?  Or don't they deserve this much credit?

Best,

John Velman


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John F. Sowa | 6 May 2007 06:27

Re: Political syntax

John V. and Bob,

That construction seems to be related to a common
syntactic feature of English:

JV> Lately I've noticed quite often that a politician
 > or bureaucrat says "I never remember X" when he or she
 > seems to want us to believe "I remember that never X".
 > Why say "I never remember..." when "I don't remember X"
 > would do?

In English, it is common to move a qualifier from the
direct object in front of the verb.  Instead of saying

    I have only five dollars.

    I believe the world isn't flat.

it is common to say

    I only have five dollars.

    I don't believe the world is flat.

But I agree with Bob Parks:

RP> Could you give a concrete example for analysis? Often the
 > context helps to understand the possible motivations for odd syntax.

John Sowa

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John Velman | 6 May 2007 23:57
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Re: Political syntax

Sometimes this may result in a distinction without a difference. This is
the case (for me at present) when considering "only". "I only have $5"
could mean "the only thing in the world that I possess is $5".  But "I have
only $5"  could mean "I have nothing in the world except $5".  I don't see
how to represent these as two different situations.

In the case of 

"I believe the world is not flat" vs.

"I do not believe the world is flat",

there is clear distinction:   The distinction between belief in a lack of
flatness, and lack of belief in flatness.  In some times and places
not(believes X) vs (believes (not X)) could be a life or death difference.

To the context of my example:   "I never remember X" has come up relatively
frequently in interviews with public figures on the Sunday morning talk
shows, or in similar venues.  The case that triggered my note occurred (if
I recall correctly) during the Republican candidates' debate on MSNBC last
Thursday.  Unfortunately I don't (right now!) recall which candidate said
it.  The second most recent incident that I recall was last Sunday on 60
Minutes when George Tenant was saying that he didn't remember any meetings
where the rational for invading Iraq was discussed (or words to that
effect)-- "I never remember any meetings like that."   This is clearly a
case where a close paraphrase is "those meetings might have occurred, and I
might have remembered them, but I never do."   Possibly a true statement,
but a strange way to phrase "I don't remember any meeting like that."  I
can't help thinking this is a "phrase of art," and he wanted us to believe
"I remember that there were no meeting like that."

On the other hand, Gonzales explained a similar situation in a recent
congressional hearing, when he said something to the effect "I don't
remember that meeting, but I've come to believe that I attended it."

Best,

John Velman

On Sun, May 06, 2007 at 12:27:25AM -0400, John F. Sowa wrote:
> John V. and Bob,
> 
> That construction seems to be related to a common
> syntactic feature of English:
> 
> JV> Lately I've noticed quite often that a politician
> > or bureaucrat says "I never remember X" when he or she
> > seems to want us to believe "I remember that never X".
> > Why say "I never remember..." when "I don't remember X"
> > would do?
> 
> In English, it is common to move a qualifier from the
> direct object in front of the verb.  Instead of saying
> 
>    I have only five dollars.
> 
>    I believe the world isn't flat.
> 
> it is common to say
> 
>    I only have five dollars.
> 
>    I don't believe the world is flat.
> 
> But I agree with Bob Parks:
> 
> RP> Could you give a concrete example for analysis? Often the
> > context helps to understand the possible motivations for odd syntax.
> 
> John Sowa
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To post a message, send mail to majordomo@... with
the 
> command 'subscribe cg' in the message body
> To unsubscribe, send mail to majordomo@... with
the 
> command 'unsubscribe cg' in the message body.
> See http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.ai.conceptualgraphs for the mailing 
> list archive.
> See http://conceptualgraphs.org for the Conceptual Graph Home Page.

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