gmane.comp.gis.openstreetmap

Ed Loach | 1 Dec 15:47

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Andy asked:

> If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has
> now stopped
> could share the reasons I might help shed some light.

I've not stopped as such, but there are a number of factors that
mean I can't contribute as much as I did initially.

When I started mapping I went out for about an hour each evening
after work capturing the local roads using GPS and then mapping them
when I got home. There were a lot to do. I can't do that now
because:

* It's dark by the time I finish work
* Most of the local roads are done, so an hour doesn't really give
me the time to get any roads that need tracing and back

So now I'm limited to taking strange routes to get from A to B to
try and add POIs, which in terms of number of points contributed
will be much fewer. Oh, and I had three hours on Saturday free that
I spent driving around Harwich, Dovercourt, and Parkeston, adding
the details to the map on Sunday though someone had helpfully traced
many of my Saturday uploaded GPX tracks already so I really just had
to apply tags in most cases and add the POIs from the photos
imported against the relevant track in JOSM.

I would guess that many of the well populated areas may have similar
issues, in that they need to go further afield now to map. The new
contributors won't be evenly distributed across the planet

(Continue reading)

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Inge Wallin | 1 Dec 17:29

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

On Monday 01 December 2008 13:59:32 Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) wrote:
> The latest charts are now online [1] and they show that the number of
> contributors has dropped in the last couple of months. The number of new
> users signing up each day hasn't changed much.
>
> Is it the northern hemisphere winter kicking in?
> Has the credit crunch or fuel prices made a difference?
> Students returning to studies?

I'd say winter.  It's definitely the case for me (Sweden) and if you look at 
the statistics you will find exactly the same dip during the same period last 
year.

> If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now stopped
> could share the reasons I might help shed some light.

I haven't actually stopped, it's just slowed down.  But I imagine others that 
could stop temporarily.

	-Inge

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Matt Amos | 1 Dec 20:38

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 4:29 PM, Inge Wallin <inge <at> lysator.liu.se> wrote:
> On Monday 01 December 2008 13:59:32 Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) wrote:
>> The latest charts are now online [1] and they show that the number of
>> contributors has dropped in the last couple of months. The number of new
>> users signing up each day hasn't changed much.
>>
>> Is it the northern hemisphere winter kicking in?
>> Has the credit crunch or fuel prices made a difference?
>> Students returning to studies?
>
> I'd say winter.  It's definitely the case for me (Sweden) and if you look at
> the statistics you will find exactly the same dip during the same period last
> year.

i've just had a look at the statistics for POIs mapped and road length
mapped over the past 12 months in the UK and Germany. i can't see any
dip last year. but then our winters don't compare to sweden's 

however, the recent drop-off in mappers correlates very nicely with
the fall in non-business sunshine hours. and is slightly correlated
with mean daytime temperature (at least in the UK).

>> If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now stopped
>> could share the reasons I might help shed some light.
>
> I haven't actually stopped, it's just slowed down.  But I imagine others that
> could stop temporarily.

i've pretty much stopped - the flash on my camera drains the battery
too quickly for night-time mapping...

(Continue reading)

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Nick Whitelegg | 4 Dec 16:30

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

>however, the recent drop-off in mappers correlates very nicely with
>the fall in non-business sunshine hours. and is slightly correlated
>with mean daytime temperature (at least in the UK).

>>> If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now 
stopped
>>> could share the reasons I might help shed some light.
>>
>> I haven't actually stopped, it's just slowed down.  But I imagine 
others that
>> could stop temporarily.

>i've pretty much stopped - the flash on my camera drains the battery
>too quickly for night-time mapping...

What about weekends though? I do almost all my mapping at weekends, even 
in the summer, and managed to do some mapping on all 10 weekend days in 
November. 

Nick

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John07 | 1 Dec 17:35

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Inge Wallin schrieb:
> On Monday 01 December 2008 13:59:32 Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) wrote:
>   
>> The latest charts are now online [1] and they show that the number of
>> contributors has dropped in the last couple of months. The number of new
>> users signing up each day hasn't changed much.
>>
>> Is it the northern hemisphere winter kicking in?
>> Has the credit crunch or fuel prices made a difference?
>> Students returning to studies?
>>     
>
> I'd say winter.  It's definitely the case for me (Sweden) and if you look at 
> the statistics you will find exactly the same dip during the same period last 
> year.
>   
Yes, the weather is one issue.  But i would love it to map in a 
snow-covered landscape 

Jonas

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Charlie Echo | 1 Dec 22:44

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

All the reactions we received seem to indicate that you found the right reasons in your original mail.

I just take this opportunity to add one suggestion: we should try to "convert" Linux users to OSM mappers.
Many Linux users would like to take part in the Open-source wave, but don't know how to code. I'm convinced
that these forces could be used for mapping.
So instead of biking in the cold, let's discuss with them in the warm...

----- Mail Original -----
De: "Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)" <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com>
À: "osm" <talk <at> openstreetmap.org>
Envoyé: Lundi 1 Décembre 2008 13:59:32 GMT +01:00 Amsterdam / Berlin / Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
Objet: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

The latest charts are now online [1] and they show that the number of
contributors has dropped in the last couple of months. The number of new
users signing up each day hasn't changed much.

Is it the northern hemisphere winter kicking in?
Has the credit crunch or fuel prices made a difference?
Students returning to studies?

If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now stopped
could share the reasons I might help shed some light.

Cheers

Andy

[1]
"http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Stats#Database_Statistics_-_Graphical"

(Continue reading)

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Steve Chilton | 2 Dec 11:49

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Several suggestions have already been made in response to Andy's comment.
Last night I jotted down just a few, before reading all my inbox, so may duplicate.
I have listed some "northern winter" thinks you can be doing - IN and OUT of the warm

If you think your local area is pretty well covered, IS IT?
Check the nonames layer. Get out and collect those missing names IN and OUT
Ditto for maplint layer. Get out and sort them out. IN and OUT

Use the excellent OSM Inspector. There is loads you can do to sort out errant geometry for instance. IN

Do some landuse mapping. Easy to walk/bike your local area and tag for residential, retail, industrial,
etc OUT

Use local knowledge or published listings (eg local authority schools lists) to crosscheck that you have
all POIs.
Get out and map any that aren't included in OSM database. IN and OUT

Check whether your country's capital city has a capital=yes tag. If not add it to it's node. Maybe then we can
show capitals at lower zooms and start making the blank early zooms more useful. IN

Ditto for country names of your immediate neighbours, maybe using osmxapi to check whether it exists in db
already. Again maybe we could then show country names at lower zooms. IN

Increasingly there will be a need to concentrate on the quality of the data and the currency of the data in the
osm db. For many this isn't as exciting as geting out with GPS and mapping white spaces but is fundamental to
the future usefulness of osm data.
Finally, of course there are masses of non-mapping activities that need loving care and attention - the
wiki and applications/coding being just two.
So - don't hibernate, activate.

(Continue reading)

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80n | 1 Dec 15:00

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

In my case I've run out of stuff to map. Can someone build some more roads please? ;)

On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 12:59 PM, Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com> wrote:

The latest charts are now online [1] and they show that the number of
contributors has dropped in the last couple of months. The number of new
users signing up each day hasn't changed much.

Is it the northern hemisphere winter kicking in?
Has the credit crunch or fuel prices made a difference?
Students returning to studies?

If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now stopped
could share the reasons I might help shed some light.

Cheers

Andy

[1]
"http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Stats#Database_Statistics_-_Graphical"

_______________________________________________
talk mailing list
talk <at> openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

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http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

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D Tucny | 1 Dec 15:11

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Think creatively... It doesn't just have to be roads... Have you done every house number? All road widths? All restrictions? Smoothness (/me ducks)? ;)

d

2008/12/1 80n <80n80n <at> gmail.com>

In my case I've run out of stuff to map. Can someone build some more roads please? ;)

On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 12:59 PM, Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com> wrote:
The latest charts are now online [1] and they show that the number of
contributors has dropped in the last couple of months. The number of new
users signing up each day hasn't changed much.

Is it the northern hemisphere winter kicking in?
Has the credit crunch or fuel prices made a difference?
Students returning to studies?

If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now stopped
could share the reasons I might help shed some light.

Cheers

Andy

[1]
"http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Stats#Database_Statistics_-_Graphical"

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Donald Allwright | 1 Dec 15:12

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

>In my case I've run out of stuff to map. Can someone build some more roads please? ;)

I think you'll find that if you start mapping footpaths, it'll at least partly solve the problem. Footpaths, by definition, cannot (legally) be cycled on so you have to do them on foot. Which means your number of miles mapped per hour of mapping drops off to a much lower level. You'll feel you've wasted your time the first time you see the results, but that feeling soon goes. :-)

Donald

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Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists | 1 Dec 16:02

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Donald Allwright wrote:
>Sent: 01 December 2008 2:13 PM
>To: 80n; talk <at> openstreetmap.org
>Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>
>>In my case I've run out of stuff to map.  Can someone build some more
>roads please? ;)
>
>I think you'll find that if you start mapping footpaths, it'll at least
>partly solve the problem. Footpaths, by definition, cannot (legally) be
>cycled on so you have to do them on foot. Which means your number of miles
>mapped per hour of mapping drops off to a much lower level. You'll feel
>you've wasted your time the first time you see the results, but that
>feeling soon goes. 

At 9:00am on a Sunday morning, the meaning of "no cycling" on urban
footpaths mysteriously disappears 

Seriously though, last winter I added the local unpaved public footpaths
that fingered out into the countryside around me. I'll be doing more this
winter but then that will have about wrapped them up. 

I reckon I have one more season of mapping to the north of Birmingham
(Walsall, Brownhills, Cannock and Lichfield etc) before like some other
contributors I'll need to refocus my mapping or move house. I'm already
mapping 10 miles from home and it really isn't justifiable to map further
out.

The real challenge as has been pointed out is the white space without a
nearby contributor. Especially in the sparsely populated locations of our
planet

Cheers

Andy

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Donald Allwright | 1 Dec 16:25

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

>At 9:00am on a Sunday morning, the meaning of "no cycling" on urban
>footpaths mysteriously disappears :-)

Unfortunately the mud doesn't, which if Saturday is anything to go by would have been a bit too much for my non-mountain bike :-)

>The real challenge as has been pointed out is the white space without a
>nearby contributor. Especially in the sparsely populated locations of our
>planet

Last winter I spent many dark evenings tracing the jungle rivers and mountain lakes in Peru from the yahoo satellite images. The vast majority of this will be nigh-on impossible to map using a GPS, so I considered this to be a useful contribution in an area previously mostly empty (OSM-wise). Some of these have probably never been mapped to this level of accuracy before. And I still haven't finished yet (Lakes are only about half-way up the country, and most of the coastal rivers still need doing), so I reckon that'll keep me going this winter. Bolivia and Brazil still have a lot of water unmapped, so that would be something you could consider. I'm sure there are many other parts of the world with similar needs. As urban areas lend themselves well to on-the-ground mappers with GPS devices these are better left to locals who can gather street names, but even here I reckon there's room for basic mapping of major highways from satellite, as that will form a framework around which people on the ground can organise their own mapping. For example people might decide to map completely a square enclosed by roads, rivers etc., but unless these features are already on the map it's harder to plan something like this. When I actually got to visit one such road I was able to adjust it on the basis of GPS data, thus improving the accuracy.

Donald

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Erik Johansson | 1 Dec 17:04

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 4:25 PM, Donald Allwright
<donald_allwright <at> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Bolivia and Brazil still have a lot of
> water unmapped, so that would be something you could consider. I'm sure
> there are many other parts of the world with similar needs

It's very common in Bolivia at least that river have very different
water levels, is there  a tag for this? Usually you have a large
riverbed and then a very small river running in the middle for most
part of the year, and then sometimes it will flood all the way up to
the riverbanks.

--

-- 
/emj

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Donald Allwright | 1 Dec 17:19

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

>It's very common in Bolivia at least that river have very different
>water levels, is there a tag for this? Usually you have a large
>riverbed and then a very small river running in the middle for most
>part of the year, and then sometimes it will flood all the way up to
>the riverbanks.

I have take the approach that the 'river' is the part where vegetation doesn't grow. A lot of the time much of this won't actually be underwater, but the actual channel within the riverbed will change very rapidly, possibly with every flooding, whereas the river bed itself will change less rapidly (but still rapidly enough that, say, 10 years down the line it will be significantly different). This is also relatively easy to tell from even low-res satellite imagery - unless the river bed has green mud of course! Looked at another way, the vegetation is there because that area hasn't had a flood severe enough to wash it away, at least within the timespan it takes for the vegetation to grow.

Having said that, if anyone can think of a better way of doing this I'm open to suggestions. I think in reality though the concept of 'edge of the river' is fairly ill-defined in areas where it hasn't been interfered with by mankind, in much the same way as the location of a coastline changes. The fact is that the coastline oscillates nearly twice a day, and low-water and high-water are merely approximations that allow us to put something on a map. You wouldn't want to build a house between the two lines though.

Donald

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Igor Brejc | 1 Dec 16:57

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

How about covering your area with land use data using yahoo/landsat? 
It's something I do occasionally at the end of the work day when I'm 
totally exhausted - it's a nice dumb work which helps my brain turn off. 
And it comes handy for various hiking maps (example of my area: 
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=46.5045&lon=15.534&zoom=12&layers=0B00FTF).

Anyway, I find mapping footpaths in forests much more interesting than 
plain old residential streets and roads - fewer people tend to cover 
them and sometimes it turns out be a real adventure - getting lost or 
meeting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Wild_Boar_Habbitat_3.jpg

Not to mention the health benefits ;)

Igor

Donald Allwright wrote:
>
> >At 9:00am on a Sunday morning, the meaning of "no cycling" on urban
> >footpaths mysteriously disappears 
>
> Unfortunately the mud doesn't, which if Saturday is anything to go by 
> would have been a bit too much for my non-mountain bike 
>
> >The real challenge as has been pointed out is the white space without a
> >nearby contributor. Especially in the sparsely populated locations of our
> >planet
>
> Last winter I spent many dark evenings tracing the jungle rivers and 
> mountain lakes in Peru from the yahoo satellite images. The vast 
> majority of this will be nigh-on impossible to map using a GPS, so I 
> considered this to be a useful contribution in an area previously 
> mostly empty (OSM-wise). Some of these have probably never been mapped 
> to this level of accuracy before. And I still haven't finished yet 
> (Lakes are only about half-way up the country, and most of the coastal 
> rivers still need doing), so I reckon that'll keep me going this 
> winter. Bolivia and Brazil still have a lot of water unmapped, so that 
> would be something you could consider. I'm sure there are many other 
> parts of the world with similar needs. As urban areas lend themselves 
> well to on-the-ground mappers with GPS devices these are better left 
> to locals who can gather street names, but even here I reckon there's 
> room for basic mapping of major highways from satellite, as that will 
> form a framework around which people on the ground can organise their 
> own mapping. For example people might decide to map completely a 
> square enclosed by roads, rivers etc., but unless these features are 
> already on the map it's harder to plan something like this. When I 
> actually got to visit one such road I was able to adjust it on the 
> basis of GPS data, thus improving the accuracy.
>
> Donald
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> talk mailing list
> talk <at> openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>   

--

-- 
http://igorbrejc.net

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Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists | 1 Dec 17:09

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Igor Brejc [mailto:igor.brejc <at> gmail.com] wrote:
>Sent: 01 December 2008 3:57 PM
>To: Donald Allwright
>Cc: Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists); 80n; talk <at> openstreetmap.org
>Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>
>How about covering your area with land use data using yahoo/landsat?
>It's something I do occasionally at the end of the work day when I'm
>totally exhausted - it's a nice dumb work which helps my brain turn off.
>And it comes handy for various hiking maps (example of my area:
>http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=46.5045&lon=15.534&zoom=12&layers=0B00FTF
>).
>
>Anyway, I find mapping footpaths in forests much more interesting than
>plain old residential streets and roads - fewer people tend to cover
>them and sometimes it turns out be a real adventure - getting lost or
>meeting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Wild_Boar_Habbitat_3.jpg
>
>Not to mention the health benefits ;)

This really depends on where you live. If you live in a major city then you
don't have much option but to map residential streets. Otherwise it's a
special trip out to the countryside. Not something you can easily do in a
lunch hour or after work.

A few locations excepted (eg the USA) the majority of urban conurbations
don't have Yahoo aerial imagery. Landsat is fine for generality but isn't
detailed enough to be of any use whatsoever in an urban sprawl. You get much
better results from detailed on the ground mapping in these instances.

Landsat is however a great starting point for blank areas of the map,
especially were water is present. Perhaps we should all strive to pick an
area of the world and add what we can from Landsat. Would be a useful drive,
especially for those that don't much like tracing Yahoo! or those that use
JOSM and find displaying Yahoo! a faff.

Cheers

Andy

>
>Igor
>
>Donald Allwright wrote:
>>
>> >At 9:00am on a Sunday morning, the meaning of "no cycling" on urban
>> >footpaths mysteriously disappears 
>>
>> Unfortunately the mud doesn't, which if Saturday is anything to go by
>> would have been a bit too much for my non-mountain bike 
>>
>> >The real challenge as has been pointed out is the white space without a
>> >nearby contributor. Especially in the sparsely populated locations of
>our
>> >planet
>>
>> Last winter I spent many dark evenings tracing the jungle rivers and
>> mountain lakes in Peru from the yahoo satellite images. The vast
>> majority of this will be nigh-on impossible to map using a GPS, so I
>> considered this to be a useful contribution in an area previously
>> mostly empty (OSM-wise). Some of these have probably never been mapped
>> to this level of accuracy before. And I still haven't finished yet
>> (Lakes are only about half-way up the country, and most of the coastal
>> rivers still need doing), so I reckon that'll keep me going this
>> winter. Bolivia and Brazil still have a lot of water unmapped, so that
>> would be something you could consider. I'm sure there are many other
>> parts of the world with similar needs. As urban areas lend themselves
>> well to on-the-ground mappers with GPS devices these are better left
>> to locals who can gather street names, but even here I reckon there's
>> room for basic mapping of major highways from satellite, as that will
>> form a framework around which people on the ground can organise their
>> own mapping. For example people might decide to map completely a
>> square enclosed by roads, rivers etc., but unless these features are
>> already on the map it's harder to plan something like this. When I
>> actually got to visit one such road I was able to adjust it on the
>> basis of GPS data, thus improving the accuracy.
>>
>> Donald
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> talk mailing list
>> talk <at> openstreetmap.org
>> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>
>
>--
>http://igorbrejc.net
>
>
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
>Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 30/11/2008
>5:53 PM

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Karl Eichwalder | 2 Dec 08:18

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

"Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)" <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com> writes:

> This really depends on where you live. If you live in a major city then you
> don't have much option but to map residential streets. Otherwise it's a
> special trip out to the countryside. Not something you can easily do in a
> lunch hour or after work.

Yes, but it depends.  In most German cities public transport systems are
not that bad.  With a bus or lightrail or even riding your bike it does
not take more than 15 or 30 minutes you are in the woods (sad story,
riding additional 15 or 30 minutes you will reach the next village or
town...).

> A few locations excepted (eg the USA) the majority of urban conurbations
> don't have Yahoo aerial imagery.

Yahoo just recently started to serve more images in the Northern Bavaria
(Franconia).  It's worth checking from time to time.

--

-- 
Karl Eichwalder

headers

Gregory | 1 Jan 17:28

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

>
>Anyway, I find mapping footpaths in forests much more interesting than
>plain old residential streets and roads

This really depends on where you live. If you live in a major city then you
don't have much option but to map residential streets. Otherwise it's a
special trip out to the countryside. Not something you can easily do in a
lunch hour or after work.

No no, in cities you can still map all the public 'footpath' alleyways between houses. One place took me quite a while to do, just because I needed several trips to avoid confusion of my GPS traces (knowing what was road, cyclepath, footpath, bad signal).
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.42659&lon=-0.3824&zoom=16&layers=B000FTF

--
Gregory
nomoregrapes <at> gmail.com
http://www.livingwithdragons.com

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Christoph Böhme | 2 Dec 00:22

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Hi!

"Andy Robinson \(blackadder-lists\)" <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com> schrieb:
> I reckon I have one more season of mapping to the north of Birmingham
> (Walsall, Brownhills, Cannock and Lichfield etc) before like some
> other contributors I'll need to refocus my mapping or move house. I'm
> already mapping 10 miles from home and it really isn't justifiable to
> map further out.

Perhaps we should cancel the push to finish Birmingham and have only
very small crumbles from the remaining cake so that it lasts longer? If
we only do two or three streets every other weekend it could last for
another year. 

Cheers,
Christoph

headers

Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists | 2 Dec 12:05

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Christoph Böhme wrote:
>Sent: 01 December 2008 11:23 PM
>To: talk <at> openstreetmap.org
>Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>
>Hi!
>
>"Andy Robinson \(blackadder-lists\)" <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com> schrieb:
>> I reckon I have one more season of mapping to the north of Birmingham
>> (Walsall, Brownhills, Cannock and Lichfield etc) before like some
>> other contributors I'll need to refocus my mapping or move house. I'm
>> already mapping 10 miles from home and it really isn't justifiable to
>> map further out.
>
>Perhaps we should cancel the push to finish Birmingham and have only
>very small crumbles from the remaining cake so that it lasts longer? If
>we only do two or three streets every other weekend it could last for
>another year. 

Oh, I don't know, I think there are still plenty of dragons close enough
just on the other side of the M5 that could keep you happy for a little
longer 

Nice to see that we are still on target for a Brum finish 

Cheers

Andy

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Dave Stubbs | 1 Dec 15:21

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

2008/12/1 80n <80n80n <at> gmail.com>:
> In my case I've run out of stuff to map.  Can someone build some more roads
> please? ;)

There's the whole world of addresses open to you + you could always
move house

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Sebastian Spaeth | 2 Dec 11:53

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

80n wrote:
> In my case I've run out of stuff to map.  Can someone build some more
> roads please? ;)

Same here. Or at the very least rename some roads please 

spaetz

headers

Chris Browet | 1 Dec 15:26

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

2008/12/1 80n <80n80n <at> gmail.com>

In my case I've run out of stuff to map. Can someone build some more roads please? ;)

Indeed, I think that the stat doesn't say much. In "crowded" areas like Germany or UK, there will be a time where there won't be anything left to map.

The real interesting stat is to see what is happening in areas where there is still much to do, but that would need to take the location of the users and the "density" of the map into account.

- Chris -

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graham | 1 Dec 17:07

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

80n wrote:
> In my case I've run out of stuff to map.  Can someone build some more 
> roads please? ;)

Surrey is finished??!! Congratulations, I missed that!

I've just realised - I have a house to let in a beautiful largely 
unmapped part of Italy and was wondering where to find customers. Now I 
know 

Graham

> 
> 
> On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 12:59 PM, Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) 
> <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com <mailto:ajrlists <at> googlemail.com>> wrote:
> 
>     The latest charts are now online [1] and they show that the number of
>     contributors has dropped in the last couple of months. The number of new
>     users signing up each day hasn't changed much.
> 
>     Is it the northern hemisphere winter kicking in?
>     Has the credit crunch or fuel prices made a difference?
>     Students returning to studies?
> 
>     If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now
>     stopped
>     could share the reasons I might help shed some light.
> 
>     Cheers
> 
>     Andy
> 
>     [1]
>     "http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Stats#Database_Statistics_-_Graphical"
> 
> 
>     _______________________________________________
>     talk mailing list
>     talk <at> openstreetmap.org <mailto:talk <at> openstreetmap.org>
>     http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
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80n | 1 Dec 18:38

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 4:07 PM, graham <graham <at> theseamans.net> wrote:

80n wrote:
> In my case I've run out of stuff to map. Can someone build some more
> roads please? ;)

Surrey is finished??!! Congratulations, I missed that!

To clarify, my immediate area is complete in every direction as far as I can go before meeting another area that is already mapped. And by complete I mean all everything down to post boxes but not as far as house numbers.

As far as Surrey is concerned all towns and large villages are fairly well mapped. I don't think we can declare it finished yet but it's not far off.

I don't know how other counties are doing. Are any others near to completion?

80n

I've just realised - I have a house to let in a beautiful largely
unmapped part of Italy and was wondering where to find customers. Now I
know

Graham

>
>
> On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 12:59 PM, Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)

> <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com <mailto:ajrlists <at> googlemail.com>> wrote:
>
> The latest charts are now online [1] and they show that the number of
> contributors has dropped in the last couple of months. The number of new
> users signing up each day hasn't changed much.
>
> Is it the northern hemisphere winter kicking in?
> Has the credit crunch or fuel prices made a difference?
> Students returning to studies?
>
> If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now
> stopped
> could share the reasons I might help shed some light.
>
> Cheers
>
> Andy
>
> [1]
> "http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Stats#Database_Statistics_-_Graphical"
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> talk mailing list

> talk <at> openstreetmap.org <mailto:talk <at> openstreetmap.org>
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>
>
>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>
> _______________________________________________
> talk mailing list
> talk <at> openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

_______________________________________________
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talk <at> openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

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Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists | 1 Dec 18:48

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

80n wrote:
>Sent: 01 December 2008 5:38 PM
>To: graham
>Cc: osm
>Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>
>On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 4:07 PM, graham <graham <at> theseamans.net> wrote:
>
>
>	80n wrote:
>	> In my case I've run out of stuff to map.  Can someone build some
>more
>	> roads please? ;)
>
>
>	Surrey is finished??!! Congratulations, I missed that!
>
>
>
>
>To clarify, my immediate area is complete in every direction as far as I
>can go before meeting another area that is already mapped. And by complete
>I mean all everything down to post boxes but not as far as house numbers.
>
>As far as Surrey is concerned all towns and large villages are fairly well
>mapped.  I don't think we can declare it finished yet but it's not far off.
>
>I don't know how other counties are doing.  Are any others near to
>completion?

Rutland of course still needs a lot of the rural highways and bridleways
adding but is otherwise in good shape from the previous mapping party.

Probably next up will be Cheshire which Chris Morley, Richard Bullock and
others have been steadily knocking off.

Cheers

Andy

headers

graham | 2 Dec 01:24

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) wrote:

> 
> Rutland of course still needs a lot of the rural highways and bridleways
> adding but is otherwise in good shape from the previous mapping party.
> 
Oh my sister lives in a village up there if I can take the bike up with 
me at Christmas I can have a look around.. Lots of hills to go up and 
down after flat London. And I know some of the bridleways already..

Graham

> Probably next up will be Cheshire which Chris Morley, Richard Bullock and
> others have been steadily knocking off.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Andy
>

headers

Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists | 1 Dec 17:15

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

graham wrote:
>Sent: 01 December 2008 4:07 PM
>To: osm
>Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>
>
>I've just realised - I have a house to let in a beautiful largely
>unmapped part of Italy and was wondering where to find customers. Now I
>know 

What part? How Big? Is it available for a mapping party 

Cheers

Andy

headers

graham | 2 Dec 01:50

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) wrote:
> graham wrote:
>> Sent: 01 December 2008 4:07 PM
>> To: osm
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>>
>>
>> I've just realised - I have a house to let in a beautiful largely
>> unmapped part of Italy and was wondering where to find customers. Now I
>> know 
> 
> What part? How Big? Is it available for a mapping party 
> 

http://informationfreeway.org/?lat=42.45526825544973&lon=13.927090173991406&zoom=17&layers=B0000F000F

The area is Abruzzo.

Penne (my town) itself is 'done' - except that a lot is guesswork as the 
streets are too narrow to get a good signal and you have to do it from 
odd points.

None of the other small towns in the area are even started. We've just 
about done the 'A' roads but lots of the others are undone.

For the rest of Abruzzo: one person has done Pescara (the capital, on 
the coast) and one Montesilvano, which joins on to it. One person is 
doing Lanciano further south, and one just started on L'Aquila (the 
other big town), but all the other towns the same size as Penne (eg. 
Chieti, Citta Sant Angelo, Atri) are still to do. There's another person 
in osm with a house to let near Teramo (also not mapped), about 40km 
north of Penne but the road between is so wiggly it makes me feel ill..

It's a very hilly area, you need to be fit if you're cycling (and I 
don't have a bike there) - but loads of little kids go shooting up the 
hills, cycling is a big sport in the area. Obviously it's flatter near 
the coast; the mountain has a huge plateau on top with trails and horse 
trekking routes - not in winter though. There is a lot of scope for 
walking mapping round small old towns, and for driving mapping round 
country roads.

My place has one double-bedroom, one with two single beds, one living 
room with sofa bed, two bathrooms. For a mapping party I'd have to cover 
my (fairly minimal) costs but have convinced my missis we could do it 
without charging otherwise, as long as it isn't in the really peak season.

There is an english lady in Penne who runs a B&B and does walking tours 
- she is grumbling about the lack of available printed maps to give her 
customers, and I was hoping to get round to doing a contour map and 
experimenting with putting one of her walking routes on it. She might be 
very amenable to letting her B&B (actually a floor in an old palazzo) be 
used if she knew she might be getting something like that back from it..

Cheers
Graham

> Cheers
> 
> Andy
>

headers

Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists | 2 Dec 12:13

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Graham,

This sounds like the makings of a plan! When would you think the ideal
timing would be? When the weather is reliable and not taking your regular
custom away?

Maybe if you could set up a wiki page with some details and travel options
to the area we (the osm community) can jointly get something set up. I'm
sure those attending would ensure your costs are covered.

Sounds like it could be a cool social and mapping gathering.

Cheers

Andy

>-----Original Message-----
>From: graham [mailto:graham <at> theseamans.net]
>Sent: 02 December 2008 12:50 AM
>To: Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)
>Cc: 'osm'
>Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>
>Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) wrote:
>> graham wrote:
>>> Sent: 01 December 2008 4:07 PM
>>> To: osm
>>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>>>
>>>
>>> I've just realised - I have a house to let in a beautiful largely
>>> unmapped part of Italy and was wondering where to find customers. Now I
>>> know 
>>
>> What part? How Big? Is it available for a mapping party 
>>
>
>http://informationfreeway.org/?lat=42.45526825544973&lon=13.927090173991406
>&zoom=17&layers=B0000F000F
>
>The area is Abruzzo.
>
>Penne (my town) itself is 'done' - except that a lot is guesswork as the
>streets are too narrow to get a good signal and you have to do it from
>odd points.
>
>None of the other small towns in the area are even started. We've just
>about done the 'A' roads but lots of the others are undone.
>
>For the rest of Abruzzo: one person has done Pescara (the capital, on
>the coast) and one Montesilvano, which joins on to it. One person is
>doing Lanciano further south, and one just started on L'Aquila (the
>other big town), but all the other towns the same size as Penne (eg.
>Chieti, Citta Sant Angelo, Atri) are still to do. There's another person
>in osm with a house to let near Teramo (also not mapped), about 40km
>north of Penne but the road between is so wiggly it makes me feel ill..
>
>It's a very hilly area, you need to be fit if you're cycling (and I
>don't have a bike there) - but loads of little kids go shooting up the
>hills, cycling is a big sport in the area. Obviously it's flatter near
>the coast; the mountain has a huge plateau on top with trails and horse
>trekking routes - not in winter though. There is a lot of scope for
>walking mapping round small old towns, and for driving mapping round
>country roads.
>
>My place has one double-bedroom, one with two single beds, one living
>room with sofa bed, two bathrooms. For a mapping party I'd have to cover
>my (fairly minimal) costs but have convinced my missis we could do it
>without charging otherwise, as long as it isn't in the really peak season.
>
>There is an english lady in Penne who runs a B&B and does walking tours
>- she is grumbling about the lack of available printed maps to give her
>customers, and I was hoping to get round to doing a contour map and
>experimenting with putting one of her walking routes on it. She might be
>very amenable to letting her B&B (actually a floor in an old palazzo) be
>used if she knew she might be getting something like that back from it..
>
>Cheers
>Graham
>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Andy
>>
>
>
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
>Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1823 - Release Date: 01/12/2008
>7:59 PM

headers

graham | 31 Dec 17:31

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Following on from this, I have finally put up a wiki page for a 
potential international mapping party in Abruzzo, Italy.

It's at http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Penne_mapping_party

If anyone is interested, please suggest a date on the page!

Cheers
Graham

Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) wrote:
> graham wrote:
>> Sent: 01 December 2008 4:07 PM
>> To: osm
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?
>>
>>
>> I've just realised - I have a house to let in a beautiful largely
>> unmapped part of Italy and was wondering where to find customers. Now I
>> know 
> 
> What part? How Big? Is it available for a mapping party 
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Andy
>

headers

sylvain letuffe | 1 Dec 17:57

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

On Monday 01 December 2008 15:00, 80n wrote:
> In my case I've run out of stuff to map.  Can someone build some more roads
> please? ;)
+1
And I don't care about street numbers
--

-- 
Sylvain Letuffe liste <at> letuffe.org
qui suis-je : http://slyserv.dyndns.org

headers

maning sambale | 2 Dec 02:16

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 10:00 PM, 80n <80n80n <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> In my case I've run out of stuff to map.  Can someone build some more roads
> please? ;)

We need more volunteers in Metro manila ;)
http://www.openstreetmap.org/index.html?lat=14.594717284692324&lon=121.03235961646361&zoom=11

You have two options:
1. Visit us and start cycling our roads.  It sunny here and there's no winter.
2. Yahoo!

cheers,
maning

--

-- 
|---------|----------------------------------------------------------|
| __.-._  |"Ohhh. Great warrior. Wars not make one great." -Yoda     |
| '-._"7' |"Freedom is still the most radical idea of all" -N.Branden|
|  /'.-c  |Linux registered user #402901, http://counter.li.org/     |
|  |  /T  |http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ |
| _)_/L I http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ |
|---------|----------------------------------------------------------|

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Elena of Valhalla | 1 Dec 15:56

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 1:59 PM, Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)
<ajrlists <at> googlemail.com> wrote:
> [...]
> If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now stopped
> could share the reasons I might help shed some light.

I have almost stopped mapping in the latest month or two for a couple
of reasons:

* less light in the evening: I can't see/take a pic of street names
when returning home in the evening, especially if it is also raining
and/or foggy
* rain and a little snow: not exactly something that encourages
outdoor activities :) (but wait for some decent snow and I will be
back mapping :) )
* a few other reason that prevented me from having free time for mapping

anyway, it's just temporary, I've already had a couple abstinence
crisis, so I hope to be back mapping soon :)

--

-- 
Elena of Valhalla

homepage: http://www.trueelena.org
email: elena.valhalla <at> gmail.com

headers

John McKerrell | 1 Dec 16:02

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

On 1 Dec 2008, at 14:56, Elena of Valhalla wrote:

> On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 1:59 PM, Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)
> <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com> wrote:
>> [...]
>> If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now  
>> stopped
>> could share the reasons I might help shed some light.

My mapping has been really sporadic this year as I don't have anything  
particularly local to work on. I did go out for a big 3 hour session  
at the weekend so hopefully that'll help to turn the graph around 

John

headers

Aun Johnsen | 1 Dec 17:59

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 07:25:10 -0800 (PST)
From: Donald Allwright <donald_allwright <at> yahoo.com>
>Bolivia and Brazil still have
>a lot of water unmapped, so that would be something you could consider.

When I have time on hand and no survey data, such as during slow hours at
work, I trace lakes and rivers in the Brazilian state of Espirito Santo
using landsat in JOSM. This area have pure Yahoo satellite coverage so
there is a shortage of high resolution data to work with. When I have no
more tracable data to work with in Espirito Santo, than I will continue on
other states. There are enough water in Brazil to keep us trace for
decades to come.

My general survey is also somewhat limited as I do not have a car, and the
areas closest to home is getting close to completed. Still working on
putting in amenities, but this also goes slow due to the fact that I
forget bringing notebooks, so I have to remember names and locations.
Things are slowly coming into the map though. Also, at times I load ALL my
GPX tracks into JOSM to see if there is a detail I have overlooked, or if
a road can be adjusted.

In other words, I am still working, still sporadic only. Saving money for
a car though.

--

-- 
Brgds
Aun Johnsen
(Over Web Mail)

headers

Gour | 1 Dec 21:36

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

>>>>> "Andy" == Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) <ajrlists <at> googlemail.com> writes:

Hi Andy,

Andy> If anyone out there who was contributing in the summer and has now
Andy> stopped could share the reasons I might help shed some light.

I got my 1st GPS (76CSx) few days ago and do not own bike (yet),
although preparing the house in the country-side where we'll move in 4
months. The whole area as well as 'my' country is not covered much, so
I'm looking forward to start working (aka: contributing) to OSM project.

Sincerely,
Gour

--

-- 

Gour  | Zagreb, Croatia  | GPG key: C6E7162D
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William Gresham | 2 Dec 01:32

Re: [OSM-talk] Where have all the contributors gone?

I'm still mapping away in southern New Jersey, don't worry.

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