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Glenn Richards | 5 Mar 2005 13:15
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Developing replacement for AT

Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a group of us
are looking at developing a replacement for the Audiotron. We're
currently building a prototype on an embedded development board, and
aiming to have the following features:

  * Support for MP3 (obviously), WAV, OGG and FLAC files
  * Extensible architecture allowing new features/formats to be added
  * USB interface for eg 802.11g interface
  * Similar UI, front panel controls/display

Additionally we're looking to possibly include the following options:

  * Ability to plug in a USB hard disk and CD-ROM. The unit would then
    function as "master", with other units on the same network operating
    as "slave". CD-ROM would enable ripping to FLAC format.

  * Web interface, as on the Audiotron

Currently we are experimenting with an embedded development board, and I
have a number of samples of a high quality Burr-Brown DAC with SPDIF
capability.

I have not included WMA or internet radio support in the above spec, as
we're aiming this at the high quality audio market and 56Kbit/sec MP3
streaming isn't quite up to audiophile standards! WMA is lossy (and
proprietary!), and the intention here is to use FLAC as the primary
format for reasons of quality.

So, anyone have any comments? Any features of the AT that you can't live
without? Or any features you've always desperately wanted on the AT?
(Continue reading)

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Glenn Richards | 7 Mar 2005 18:32
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Re: Developing replacement for AT

Glenn Richards wrote:

> Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage...

Ok, this will be the last message in here from me on this topic - had an
email from Seth asking me to end the discussion, which is the purpose of
this message!

The only thing I will take issue with is the term "competing product".
Because the Audiotron isn't available for purchase I don't see how it
can be a competing product.

A project like this does take a lot of work, and if somehow the
Audiotron were available again to purchase tomorrow we wouldn't bother
developing it!

Anyway, thanks everyone for your input. Normal service will now resume!

--
  Glenn Richards                                     Tel: (01453) 845735
  Squirrel Solutions                 http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

  IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation
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Michael Wagner | 7 Mar 2005 18:53
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Re: Developing replacement for AT

----- Original Message -----

> Glenn Richards wrote:
>
> if somehow the Audiotron were available again to purchase tomorrow we
wouldn't bother developing it!

My point exactly (and more succinctly).

Michael Wagner
michael <at> hamond.com
905-761-9094
Director, Hamond Industries Ltd
- - - - - - - - -
Web site: www.hamond.com
weB LOG www.stampingoutaliving.com
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Abraham, Howard E. | 7 Mar 2005 14:33
Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Hmmm...hadn't thought of that.  That IS a good idea.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum [mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of
Dalvenjah FoxFire
Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2005 9:17 PM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

>>>>> "glenn" == Glenn Richards <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK> writes:

    glenn> I guess you just can't keep everyone happy... but the
    glenn> majority of people seem to want streaming media / internet
    glenn> radio support, so we'll include this as it seems to be
    glenn> fairly trivial.

One feature that I've wanted for a while for the AT or some other player is the ability to "throw" a streaming
audio URL to it. In other words, if I go to say www.npr.org and want to listen to this weeks' Wait Wait Don't
Tell Me show, I'd like to be able to click on the RealAudio link and have the option of starting the playback
on the AudioTron through my home stereo system, instead of out the laptop's speakers.

Right now the hack I use to get this working is with NiceCast, which hijacks the audio output of any locally
running program (in this case
RealPlayer) and re-encodes it to an IceCast server on the laptop, which the AT through TurtleRadio
connects to. And this works OK; but it would be nice to be able to just throw a URL without having to go through
too onerous a process.

(I realize this case would also require licensing the RealPlayer decoder; even just MP3 and WMA would work
too though.)
(Continue reading)

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Abraham, Howard E. | 7 Mar 2005 14:30
Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

I'd like to see streaming aacPlus support.  The lack thereof is currently the only complaint I have with the AudioTron.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 11:16 PM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a group of us are looking at developing a
replacement for the Audiotron. We're currently building a prototype on an embedded development board,
and aiming to have the following features:

  * Support for MP3 (obviously), WAV, OGG and FLAC files
  * Extensible architecture allowing new features/formats to be added
  * USB interface for eg 802.11g interface
  * Similar UI, front panel controls/display

Additionally we're looking to possibly include the following options:

  * Ability to plug in a USB hard disk and CD-ROM. The unit would then
    function as "master", with other units on the same network operating
    as "slave". CD-ROM would enable ripping to FLAC format.

  * Web interface, as on the Audiotron

Currently we are experimenting with an embedded development board, and I have a number of samples of a high
quality Burr-Brown DAC with SPDIF capability.

I have not included WMA or internet radio support in the above spec, as we're aiming this at the high quality
(Continue reading)

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G.Hood | 7 Mar 2005 09:16
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Re: Developing replacement for AT


I'd pay for a Palm app to control the AT - the index_thin page doesn't
quite cut it.

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Josh Coalson | 6 Mar 2005 22:52
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Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

according to that argument, not supporting real audio or
c-64 SID files is "forcing the consumer into doing things the
way you dictate."  surely you realize that there is a tradeoff
involved, that WMA is propietary and requires a probably-non-
free, possibly expensive, license from MS, maybe even with other
unacceptable encumbrances.

no one device is going to satisfy everyone.

Josh

--- Danny Rego <danny <at> REGO.COM> wrote:
> By that statement though, you are forcing the consumer (or potential
> consumer) into doing things the way you dictate.  I don't use FLAC
> for one
> reason, my players of choice do not, and cannot support it at this
> point.
> So why would I want to re-rip my collection to flac, just to use this
> new
> product?
>
> WMA is popular, whether people want to admit it, or not.  If $$$ is
> an
> issue, then I understand.  Any other reason is just Anti-MS BS.
>
> Danny Rego
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Glenn Richards" <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK>
(Continue reading)

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Josh Coalson | 6 Mar 2005 22:45
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Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

--- Glenn Richards <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK> wrote:
> Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a group of
> us
> are looking at developing a replacement for the Audiotron. We're
> currently building a prototype on an embedded development board, and
> aiming to have the following features:
...
> So, anyone have any comments? Any features of the AT that you can't
> live
> without? Or any features you've always desperately wanted on the AT?

looks cool.  feel free to ask if you have questions or need help
with the FLAC implementation (I wrote FLAC).

my little dropping of "advice"... if you plan on making money
from the margin on device sales, and not one of these models
like some subscription thing or "give the printer, overcharge
for ink" or other such thing that requires controlling the
customer, then I would say make the thing as open and hackable
as possible without driving up the costs.  some examples:

1. use linux for the device OS and/or open-source the client
2. make it easy to change the firmware
3. bring as many niceties (e.g. a serial port) to headers on
   the board.  much cheaper than adding a bunch of external
   connectors but MUCH better for hacking that trying to solder
   stuff to tiny SM pins.

things like 3) can allow you to whittle down the features/cost
and still get the 'fringe customers'... like if 1% reply and say
(Continue reading)

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Peter G. Viscarola | 6 Mar 2005 06:09

Re: Developing replacement for AT

What are you targeting, realistically, in terms of price?

I have a sneaking suspicion that people on this list, even those who've
replied to you that they're interested in this project, have *vastly*
differing ideas as to what a "reasonable" price they'd be willing to
pay.

Another random question, if I may:

Are you planning to use Windows CE as the OS??  Probably might as well
if you plan to do CIFS to access remote shares.  That also gets you the
web server and MP3 decode (hmmm, wonder if it includes WMA) in the
bargain... Which ain't bad for, what, $15/unit license cost (and that's
for the Professional all-singing-all-dancing level license).

P
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Tony Przygienda | 6 Mar 2005 12:14

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Peter G. Viscarola wrote:

>What are you targeting, realistically, in terms of price?
>
>
yes, price is an interesting object. Either make a Roku under price or
otherwise
hoover around Roku price but differentiate (control without remote, good
http
interface without server side software and so on).

I see a great potential for people not willing to pay exorbitant prices
for proprietary
multi-room sound systems. That was the reason I went with Audiotrons
(have 3,
would need another 3 or so), people like CorAccess have modules to drive
Audiotrons
via WEB interface. It's the only alternative to paying an arm and a leg
for a
proprietary system. Implies: Make an exact Audiotron compatible http
controlling
interface and there should be market by integrators that want to drive
prices down
(albeit I'm sure B&O and people like that give them huge margins so
maybe they
don't want competition actually)

    -- tony
(Continue reading)

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Matt | 7 Mar 2005 02:57

Re: Developing replacement for AT - Suprised? Seth?

Im suprised Seth hasnt chimed it as of yet.  He usually frowns on
discussions of replacement AT products.

It must be because of the weekend.  It always cracks me up when we use a
company's mailing list to push a replacement product.  I think the one
difference here is that the product we are trying to replace is going out
to pasture....

Tony Przygienda said:
> Peter G. Viscarola wrote:
>
>>What are you targeting, realistically, in terms of price?
>>
>>
> yes, price is an interesting object. Either make a Roku under price or
> otherwise
> hoover around Roku price but differentiate (control without remote, good
> http
> interface without server side software and so on).
>
> I see a great potential for people not willing to pay exorbitant prices
> for proprietary
> multi-room sound systems. That was the reason I went with Audiotrons
> (have 3,
> would need another 3 or so), people like CorAccess have modules to drive
> Audiotrons
> via WEB interface. It's the only alternative to paying an arm and a leg
> for a
> proprietary system. Implies: Make an exact Audiotron compatible http
> controlling
(Continue reading)

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Arnt Gulbrandsen | 6 Mar 2005 11:35
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Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Peter G. Viscarola writes:
> What are you targeting, realistically, in terms of price?
>
> I have a sneaking suspicion that people on this list, even those
> who've replied to you that they're interested in this project, have
> *vastly* differing ideas as to what a "reasonable" price they'd be
> willing to pay.

Yes. Not everyone will pay audiophile prices. Some will probably want a
lower price for the unit than what you pay for the display alone.

Arnt
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Dave Miller | 6 Mar 2005 01:11

Re: Developing replacement for AT

I'm finding that the Roku Photobridge is meeting many of the capabilities of the audiotron and far
exceeding it in that also streams hi-def video and photos.  It does not require a pc but does require a
television on to navigate.  

The things I much prefer about the AT right now are:
* ease of use, the front interface I use a lot just to select internet radio or random through my music.  It
works like my stereo gear without the TV.
* extremely reliable, this is an issue with the Roku right now (I am using beta software)

With the roku, coding and third party applications you can:
* stream dvds from disk
* hexradio, third party turtleradio like 
* custom UIs have been created.
* custom movie player that is pretty nice (third party)
* hi-def output capability
* next beta will have UPnP support which opens up a whole myriad of options
* has web server, but will require custom code to control the device.  There's also other ways to control it remotely.

Things I don't like:
* overheats, it can't be near anything else and gets flakey when it overheats
* reliability, I think mainly due to heat though

I still almost always use my AT for music, but there is also a very strong development community around this
device.  Check out their forums, it will give you a much better idea of it's capabilities.

________________________________

From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum on behalf of Jim Anderson
Sent: Sat 3/5/2005 3:09 PM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
(Continue reading)

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groups9 | 5 Mar 2005 23:38
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Re: Developing replacement for AT

Given the cost of building anything decent of this nature will end up
costing more than $100 if not double or triple. 

I wonder how many people would be willing to pay Turtle Beach for a real
upgrade. I would pay $100. I don't know if it's worth it for them to
apply resources to the AT just for upgrades and if those resources are
still around or have been laid off already. 

In my dreams it would be nice to release the source, even with out the
M$oft proprietary CE modules. - hey it's just a dream.

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Henry Turner
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 12:53 PM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

you realize, that when Seth comes to work on Monday, he will put an end
to
this discussion.
How about setting up a yahoo group or something that we can follow your
progress and discuss the development issues.
Hank

----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Richards" <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK>
To: <AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM>
(Continue reading)

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Jim Anderson | 5 Mar 2005 18:02
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Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

I know it's not "cool" to embrace anything from Microsoft, but lossless WMA makes sense to a lot of
audiophiles -

Jim

Joe Craig <jncraig <at> GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> I have not included WMA or internet radio support in the above spec

There are times I just want to listen to the radio! I'd not want to
have to have a second device for that ...

Joe
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Kimmo Suominen | 5 Mar 2005 22:18
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Re: Developing replacement for AT

Joe Craig <jncraig <at> GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> There are times I just want to listen to the radio! I'd not want to
> have to have a second device for that ...

99% of my AT use is for playing back a local MP3 stream, so I'd really
like to see "Internet Radio" supported.  It would be nice to have it
supported using playlists (M3U and/or PLS files), the way Squeezebox
does it.

Also, please make the power supply universal.  I'm going to be in the
220V part of the world soon...  :-)  It would be great to just get the
local power cable when moving to another voltage (like I can do with
PC's and monitors these days).

Regards,
+ Kim
--
<A HREF="http://kimmo.suominen.com/">Kimmo Suominen</A>
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Arnt Gulbrandsen | 5 Mar 2005 18:35
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Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Jim Anderson writes:
> I know it's not "cool" to embrace anything from Microsoft, but
> lossless WMA makes sense to a lot of audiophiles -

There are reasons why it's not cool. Embracing Microsoft stuff typically
involves paying Microsoft more than you like or else doing a hell or a
lot of work - or both.

Arnt
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Lee Sarver | 5 Mar 2005 22:31
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Re: Developing replacement for AT

I wouldn't miss WMA at all.  DRM in any form is a huge negative for me,
regardless of audio quality.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM]On Behalf Of Arnt Gulbrandsen
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 11:35 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Jim Anderson writes:
> I know it's not "cool" to embrace anything from Microsoft, but
> lossless WMA makes sense to a lot of audiophiles -

There are reasons why it's not cool. Embracing Microsoft stuff typically
involves paying Microsoft more than you like or else doing a hell or a
lot of work - or both.

Arnt
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Danny Rego | 6 Mar 2005 19:15

Re: Developing replacement for AT

WMA files do not mean DRM.

Danny Rego

----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Sarver" <lsarver <at> COMCAST.NET>
To: <AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM>
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 4:31 PM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

>I wouldn't miss WMA at all.  DRM in any form is a huge negative for me,
> regardless of audio quality.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
> [mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM]On Behalf Of Arnt Gulbrandsen
> Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 11:35 AM
> To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
> Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT
>
>
> Jim Anderson writes:
>> I know it's not "cool" to embrace anything from Microsoft, but
>> lossless WMA makes sense to a lot of audiophiles -
>
> There are reasons why it's not cool. Embracing Microsoft stuff typically
> involves paying Microsoft more than you like or else doing a hell or a
> lot of work - or both.
>
> Arnt
(Continue reading)

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Jim Anderson | 6 Mar 2005 00:09
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Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Keep in mind that DRM is optional.  You can rip any CD lossless with no DRM
whatsoever.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Lee Sarver
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 3:31 PM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

I wouldn't miss WMA at all.  DRM in any form is a huge negative for me,
regardless of audio quality.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM]On Behalf Of Arnt Gulbrandsen
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 11:35 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Jim Anderson writes:
> I know it's not "cool" to embrace anything from Microsoft, but
> lossless WMA makes sense to a lot of audiophiles -

There are reasons why it's not cool. Embracing Microsoft stuff typically
involves paying Microsoft more than you like or else doing a hell or a lot
of work - or both.

Arnt
(Continue reading)

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Lee Sarver | 6 Mar 2005 09:36
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

I do:  .wavs for home and .mp3s for the road.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM]On Behalf Of Jim Anderson
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 5:10 PM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Keep in mind that DRM is optional.  You can rip any CD lossless with no DRM
whatsoever.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Lee Sarver
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 3:31 PM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

I wouldn't miss WMA at all.  DRM in any form is a huge negative for me,
regardless of audio quality.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM]On Behalf Of Arnt Gulbrandsen
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 11:35 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Jim Anderson writes:
(Continue reading)

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Glenn Richards | 5 Mar 2005 19:08
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Re: Developing replacement for AT

Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote:

>> I know it's not "cool" to embrace anything from Microsoft, but
>> lossless WMA makes sense to a lot of audiophiles -
> There are reasons why it's not cool. Embracing Microsoft stuff typically
> involves paying Microsoft more than you like or else doing a hell or a
> lot of work - or both.

One of the design priorities is to have OGG and FLAC support, something
that was always missing from the AT. FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec -
see http://flac.sourceforge.net/ IIRC) would eliminate the need for WMA
lossless.

We want to avoid proprietary formats where possible. While technically
MP3 is proprietary due to various patents, it's so widespread that this
isn't an issue, and there are many open-source players available.

--
  Glenn Richards                                     Tel: (01453) 845735
  Squirrel Solutions                 http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

  IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation
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Danny Rego | 6 Mar 2005 19:11

Re: Developing replacement for AT

By that statement though, you are forcing the consumer (or potential
consumer) into doing things the way you dictate.  I don't use FLAC for one
reason, my players of choice do not, and cannot support it at this point.
So why would I want to re-rip my collection to flac, just to use this new
product?

WMA is popular, whether people want to admit it, or not.  If $$$ is an
issue, then I understand.  Any other reason is just Anti-MS BS.

Danny Rego

----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Richards" <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK>
To: <AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM>
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 1:08 PM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

> Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote:
>
>>> I know it's not "cool" to embrace anything from Microsoft, but
>>> lossless WMA makes sense to a lot of audiophiles -
>> There are reasons why it's not cool. Embracing Microsoft stuff typically
>> involves paying Microsoft more than you like or else doing a hell or a
>> lot of work - or both.
>
> One of the design priorities is to have OGG and FLAC support, something
> that was always missing from the AT. FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec -
> see http://flac.sourceforge.net/ IIRC) would eliminate the need for WMA
> lossless.
>
(Continue reading)

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Glenn Richards | 6 Mar 2005 20:09
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Danny Rego wrote:

> By that statement though, you are forcing the consumer (or potential
> consumer) into doing things the way you dictate.  I don't use FLAC for one
> reason, my players of choice do not, and cannot support it at this point.
> So why would I want to re-rip my collection to flac, just to use this new
> product?

You don't have to - it'll support MP3 and OGG.

> WMA is popular, whether people want to admit it, or not.  If $$$ is an
> issue, then I understand.  Any other reason is just Anti-MS BS.

So far my attempts to find an open source WMA player have been
unsuccessful. If I do manage to find something that doesn't require
paying large amounts of cash to M$, and doesn't require sacrificing
functionality in other areas, I'd consider including it. But it's not a
format I ever use, and I don't know anyone other than on this list that
uses it.

I guess you just can't keep everyone happy... but the majority of people
seem to want streaming media / internet radio support, so we'll include
this as it seems to be fairly trivial. As I said, we'll look at WMA
support, and if practical we'll include it.

--
  Glenn Richards                                     Tel: (01453) 845735
  Squirrel Solutions                 http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

  IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation
(Continue reading)

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Dalvenjah FoxFire | 7 Mar 2005 04:17
Favicon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

>>>>> "glenn" == Glenn Richards <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK> writes:

    glenn> I guess you just can't keep everyone happy... but the
    glenn> majority of people seem to want streaming media / internet
    glenn> radio support, so we'll include this as it seems to be
    glenn> fairly trivial.

One feature that I've wanted for a while for the AT or some other player
is the ability to "throw" a streaming audio URL to it. In other words,
if I go to say www.npr.org and want to listen to this weeks' Wait Wait
Don't Tell Me show, I'd like to be able to click on the RealAudio link
and have the option of starting the playback on the AudioTron through
my home stereo system, instead of out the laptop's speakers.

Right now the hack I use to get this working is with NiceCast, which
hijacks the audio output of any locally running program (in this case
RealPlayer) and re-encodes it to an IceCast server on the laptop,
which the AT through TurtleRadio connects to. And this works OK;
but it would be nice to be able to just throw a URL without
having to go through too onerous a process.

(I realize this case would also require licensing the RealPlayer decoder;
even just MP3 and WMA would work too though.)

Just throwing it out there as my wish-item.

-dalvenjah
--
(Continue reading)

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Eddie | 6 Mar 2005 22:16
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Re: Developing replacement for AT

Not sure, but does MPlayer support WMA?  I don't have any to test.
I know if plays Windows video, WMV (or something like that).

On Sun, 6 Mar 2005 19:09:53 +0000, Glenn Richards wrote:

>Danny Rego wrote:
>
>> By that statement though, you are forcing the consumer (or potential
>> consumer) into doing things the way you dictate.  I don't use FLAC for one
>> reason, my players of choice do not, and cannot support it at this point.
>> So why would I want to re-rip my collection to flac, just to use this new
>> product?
>
>You don't have to - it'll support MP3 and OGG.
>
>> WMA is popular, whether people want to admit it, or not.  If $$$ is an
>> issue, then I understand.  Any other reason is just Anti-MS BS.
>
>So far my attempts to find an open source WMA player have been
>unsuccessful. If I do manage to find something that doesn't require
>paying large amounts of cash to M$, and doesn't require sacrificing
>functionality in other areas, I'd consider including it. But it's not a
>format I ever use, and I don't know anyone other than on this list that
>uses it.
>
>I guess you just can't keep everyone happy... but the majority of people
>seem to want streaming media / internet radio support, so we'll include
>this as it seems to be fairly trivial. As I said, we'll look at WMA
>support, and if practical we'll include it.
>
(Continue reading)

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andrew.winch | 5 Mar 2005 17:42
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

I second this request.  Not needing server side software is major. I have all of my music on a NAS and my AT just
goes an gets it. It was a major reason for my getting the AT.

Other requests:
Digital outs (optical is a must, coax would be a nice plus)
RJ-45 Net connector
Same audio style case dimensions (and druthers on the color is black)
VFD type of display (I think that is the name)
Please break the 32K song limit.
Ability to use an external TOC generator.

-----Original Message-----
From: "Peter G. Viscarola" <PeterGV <at> OSR.COM>
Sent: Mar 5, 2005 10:02 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

I'm particularly fond of the AT's feature of not requiring server-side
software to communicate with the AT.  Is this in your plan?  I assume a
hard-wired ethernet interface is on your feature list as well?

Regarding a previous poster's request for Ipod connectivity: Once
connected, you interact with the ipod like it were a disk.  So, THAT"s
not a problem.  The only pain is keeping the "index" files up to date.
This has been reverse engineered, and there are several implementations
available on the web.

P

> -----Original Message-----
(Continue reading)

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Lee Sarver | 5 Mar 2005 22:32
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Good point(s).  Each is a must have.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM]On Behalf Of
andrew.winch <at> MINDSPRING.COM
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 10:42 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

I second this request.  Not needing server side software is major. I have
all of my music on a NAS and my AT just goes an gets it. It was a major
reason for my getting the AT.

Other requests:
Digital outs (optical is a must, coax would be a nice plus)
RJ-45 Net connector
Same audio style case dimensions (and druthers on the color is black)
VFD type of display (I think that is the name)
Please break the 32K song limit.
Ability to use an external TOC generator.

-----Original Message-----
From: "Peter G. Viscarola" <PeterGV <at> OSR.COM>
Sent: Mar 5, 2005 10:02 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

I'm particularly fond of the AT's feature of not requiring server-side
software to communicate with the AT.  Is this in your plan?  I assume a
(Continue reading)

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Glenn Richards | 5 Mar 2005 19:05
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

andrew.winch <at> MINDSPRING.COM wrote:

> Digital outs (optical is a must, coax would be a nice plus)

Absolutely. I have one of my ATs plugged into an Arcam Black Box 50, the
other into a Yamaha DSP-AX620. We're planning on putting both types of
output on to keep the audiophiles happy... co-ax sounds slightly better
(I can understand why, the conversion to optical and back to electrical
introduces jitter). I've actually tested this from a DVD player with
both optical and co-ax outputs, and the co-ax does indeed sound a little
better. Not much in it though, more important would be the practicality
of having two digital outputs.

> RJ-45 Net connector

That goes without saying, 100Mbit full-duplex.

> Same audio style case dimensions (and druthers on the color is black)

Again, that's part of the design spec.

> VFD type of display (I think that is the name)

Yeah, the cold cathode fluorescent type as featured on most consumer
electronics... that's the ultimate aim as it does look better.
Prototypes will probably have an LCD display, but we're aiming to
replace that with VFD in the finished product.

> Please break the 32K song limit.
(Continue reading)

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Henry Turner | 5 Mar 2005 19:52
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

you realize, that when Seth comes to work on Monday, he will put an end to
this discussion.
How about setting up a yahoo group or something that we can follow your
progress and discuss the development issues.
Hank

----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Richards" <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK>
To: <AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM>
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 1:05 PM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

> andrew.winch <at> MINDSPRING.COM wrote:
>
>> Digital outs (optical is a must, coax would be a nice plus)
>
> Absolutely. I have one of my ATs plugged into an Arcam Black Box 50, the
> other into a Yamaha DSP-AX620. We're planning on putting both types of
> output on to keep the audiophiles happy... co-ax sounds slightly better
> (I can understand why, the conversion to optical and back to electrical
> introduces jitter). I've actually tested this from a DVD player with
> both optical and co-ax outputs, and the co-ax does indeed sound a little
> better. Not much in it though, more important would be the practicality
> of having two digital outputs.
>
>> RJ-45 Net connector
>
> That goes without saying, 100Mbit full-duplex.
>
>> Same audio style case dimensions (and druthers on the color is black)
(Continue reading)

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Kimmo Suominen | 5 Mar 2005 22:10
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

May I shamelessly plug the NetAudio list again... :-)

http://mx.gw.com/mailman/listinfo/netaudio

Regards,
+ Kim
--
<A HREF="http://kimmo.suominen.com/">Kimmo Suominen</A>

On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 01:52:34PM -0500, Henry Turner wrote:
> you realize, that when Seth comes to work on Monday, he will put an end to
> this discussion.
> How about setting up a yahoo group or something that we can follow your
> progress and discuss the development issues.
> Hank
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groups9 | 5 Mar 2005 17:16
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

1.    A well featured remote control (via network) API

2.    Are you planning to make this an open project (sourceforge etc)?

3.    Is this for a commercial project?

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of phil Galli
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 9:43 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Don't know to what extent the protocols are available (free or for a

charge)but there are 3rd party products on the street that allow the
Ipod to

plug in and play the ipod.  So at the very minimum the AP would act as a

broadcaster of Ipod based music.

If one 3rd party manufacturer can use it then all can use it (either
free or

for a lic) with 10 million sold to date I would hate not to be part of
the
(Continue reading)

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Glenn Richards | 5 Mar 2005 18:50
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

groups9 wrote:

> 1.    A well featured remote control (via network) API

Already on the cards.

> 2.    Are you planning to make this an open project (sourceforge etc)?

Depends. Ideally I would like this to be an open project, if commercial
interests allow it. Basically if it hits "critical mass" then I'd like
to be able to release all the source code etc to allow people to hack.

> 3.    Is this for a commercial project?

Yes, but see above.

--
  Glenn Richards                                     Tel: (01453) 845735
  Squirrel Solutions                 http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

  IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation
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Peter G. Viscarola | 5 Mar 2005 16:02

Re: Developing replacement for AT

I'm particularly fond of the AT's feature of not requiring server-side
software to communicate with the AT.  Is this in your plan?  I assume a
hard-wired ethernet interface is on your feature list as well?

Regarding a previous poster's request for Ipod connectivity: Once
connected, you interact with the ipod like it were a disk.  So, THAT"s
not a problem.  The only pain is keeping the "index" files up to date.
This has been reverse engineered, and there are several implementations
available on the web.

P 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum 
> [mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
> Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 7:16 AM
> To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
> Subject: [AT] Developing replacement for AT
> 
> Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a 
> group of us are looking at developing a replacement for the 
> Audiotron. We're currently building a prototype on an 
> embedded development board, and aiming to have the following features:
> 
>   * Support for MP3 (obviously), WAV, OGG and FLAC files
>   * Extensible architecture allowing new features/formats to be added
>   * USB interface for eg 802.11g interface
>   * Similar UI, front panel controls/display
> 
> Additionally we're looking to possibly include the following options:
(Continue reading)

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Glenn Richards | 5 Mar 2005 18:46
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Peter G. Viscarola wrote:

> I'm particularly fond of the AT's feature of not requiring
> server-side software to communicate with the AT.  Is this in your
> plan?

Of course - unlike the AT it may need to be told which shares to search
rather than just finding them itself however. While the idea behind this
on the AT is great, in practice it tends to find all sorts of junk and
takes ages to search.

The closest it'll get to "server-side software" is the ability to
generate a TOC file, speeding up loading times. I use this myself, all
the MP3 metadata from the ID3 tags is stored in a MySQL database, and a
small script generates the atron.vtc file, alltracks.m3u files, and
provides a back-end for the Pinnacle ShowCenter and MediaMVP units
scattered around the house in addition to the two ATs.

The way my ATs are set up is that they search \\media\mp3 at startup,
with a TOC file present. This means they load 7,000 tracks in a few seconds.

> I assume a hard-wired ethernet interface is on your feature list as
> well?

Yes, unlike the AT it'll be 10/100Mbit, as FLAC requires a higher
bandwidth anyway and more and more switches seem to be 100Mbit only.
Nowadays the difference in price between 10 and 10/100 is pennies,
indeed 10Mbit Ethernet chips are quite rare.

--
(Continue reading)

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Michael Wagner | 7 Mar 2005 04:45
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

At 3/5/05 12:46 PM  Saturday, Glenn Richards wrote:
>unlike the AT it'll be 10/100Mbit

Any reason not to go all the way to gigabit?

I'm far from hardware design these days ... I have no idea whether
affordable chip sets can do this yet.

Michael

http://home.cogeco.ca/~michaelwagner/personal-page.htm
"All I wanna do is have a little fun before I die" Sheryl Crow
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David Black | 7 Mar 2005 09:44

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Not sure if it's been mentioned but streaming real audio support would be a
huge plus for me - miss the bbc radio on my audiotron...

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 11:16 PM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a group of us
are looking at developing a replacement for the Audiotron. We're
currently building a prototype on an embedded development board, and
aiming to have the following features:

  * Support for MP3 (obviously), WAV, OGG and FLAC files
  * Extensible architecture allowing new features/formats to be added
  * USB interface for eg 802.11g interface
  * Similar UI, front panel controls/display

Additionally we're looking to possibly include the following options:

  * Ability to plug in a USB hard disk and CD-ROM. The unit would then
    function as "master", with other units on the same network operating
    as "slave". CD-ROM would enable ripping to FLAC format.

  * Web interface, as on the Audiotron

Currently we are experimenting with an embedded development board, and I
have a number of samples of a high quality Burr-Brown DAC with SPDIF
(Continue reading)

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Jamie Edgar | 5 Mar 2005 23:45

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Great idea.

1: The web interface is obviously crucial, but I must say I use ATTray
interface on all my PCs in the house and it's performance & GUI is much
better than the default web interface.  If you remake the web-server --
think about that GUI / interface.

2: Support for Pocket PC - for handheld use.

3: Queuing: Support to move files in/out of queue with out effecting current
song playing (like WinAmp).

4: Support for more than 10,000 songs

5: I never use the front of the AT (only to cycle power), how about a remote
reboot?

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 7:16 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a group of us are
looking at developing a replacement for the Audiotron. We're currently
building a prototype on an embedded development board, and aiming to have
the following features:

  * Support for MP3 (obviously), WAV, OGG and FLAC files
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Michael Wagner | 7 Mar 2005 04:55
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

At 3/5/05 05:45 PM  Saturday, Jamie Edgar wrote:
>If you remake the web-server -- think about that GUI / interface.

Yes. I have many ideas here. But the single biggest one is responsiveness.
It's absolutely lethal to wait 6 seconds for a status update, especially
just after starting a new song. Makes DJing off the box impossible.

>3: Queuing: Support to move files in/out of queue with out effecting current
>song playing (like WinAmp).

or Slim. Absolutely important.

>4: Support for more than 10,000 songs

already there, I believe. I think the limit is 30,000 now. But the real
limit is what that does to responsiveness and performance.

Michael

http://home.cogeco.ca/~michaelwagner/personal-page.htm
"All I wanna do is have a little fun before I die" Sheryl Crow
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James Fraser | 5 Mar 2005 21:03
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Sneaking it in on a Saturday morning, Glenn wrote:
> So, anyone have any comments? Any features of the AT that you can't live
> without? Or any features you've always desperately wanted on the AT?

I desperately want support for the 2.4 tags, [particularly the separate
search order tags (TSOP?). That way I can have Bob Marley & the Wailers
grouped with Bob Marley, both of which come up under M, not B.

If you've got the horsepower, volume control on the remote for the digital
out would be nice. My old school mid-fi pre-amp doesn't do the remote
control thing.

Slightly out of the way feature I love about the AT: Selecting everything
plays _entire_albums_ in a random order. It can easily be set to tracks
randomly by using the random button.

I use the interface on the unit itself 95% of the time, and that interface
has to be responsive and intuitive (read "wife friendly.")

I've never used the headphone jack, and if you are aiming at audiophiles,
they will prefer a separate headphone amp anyway.

Jamie Fraser
jamie <at> widernets.com
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Danny Rego | 5 Mar 2005 18:27

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Sorry, but I wouldn't touch any device that doesn't support WMA.  Of all of
the lossy fle types, I find WMA to have the best quality.  Aside from that,
it is a very popular format, and I wouldn't want to own a device that I have
to pussyfoot around with to play my files.

Danny Rego

----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Richards" <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK>
To: <AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM>
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 7:15 AM
Subject: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

> Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a group of us
> are looking at developing a replacement for the Audiotron. We're
> currently building a prototype on an embedded development board, and
> aiming to have the following features:
>
>  * Support for MP3 (obviously), WAV, OGG and FLAC files
>  * Extensible architecture allowing new features/formats to be added
>  * USB interface for eg 802.11g interface
>  * Similar UI, front panel controls/display
>
> Additionally we're looking to possibly include the following options:
>
>  * Ability to plug in a USB hard disk and CD-ROM. The unit would then
>    function as "master", with other units on the same network operating
>    as "slave". CD-ROM would enable ripping to FLAC format.
>
>  * Web interface, as on the Audiotron
(Continue reading)

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Glenn Richards | 5 Mar 2005 19:10
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Danny Rego wrote:

> Sorry, but I wouldn't touch any device that doesn't support WMA.  Of
> all of the lossy fle types, I find WMA to have the best quality.

Have you tried OGG Vorbis? Better compression and smaller file size than
MP3, the only reason I don't use it myself is because none of my
hardware devices (AT and in-car MP3 CD players) will support it.

> Aside from that, it is a very popular format, and I wouldn't want to
> own a device that I have to pussyfoot around with to play my files.

If there's a way of including WMA without headaches then we'll
definitely look into it, on the grounds that we want to support as many
filetypes as possible.

--
  Glenn Richards                                     Tel: (01453) 845735
  Squirrel Solutions                 http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

  IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation
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Simon Walker | 7 Mar 2005 10:29
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

I really have to push out for WMA here, 95% of my audio is stored in WMA
format, I have no intent on re-recording or changing file formats to suit
someone else, as it works on all my devices (inc the portable ones) and I am
very happy with the quality vs. file size.

When I'm not listening to the WMA files, then I'm listening to Internet
radio (club 977 - 80's radio) especially.

It may not be want you want to hear, however if you are developing a
replacement for the AT then as a bare minimum, it should do everything that
the current AT does, including WMA and Internet Radio

Thanks

Simon Walker

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
Sent: 05 March 2005 18:11
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Danny Rego wrote:

> Sorry, but I wouldn't touch any device that doesn't support WMA.  Of
> all of the lossy fle types, I find WMA to have the best quality.

Have you tried OGG Vorbis? Better compression and smaller file size than
MP3, the only reason I don't use it myself is because none of my
(Continue reading)

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Max Kamhi | 7 Mar 2005 15:54

Re: Developing replacement for AT

YES!

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Simon Walker
Sent: Monday, March 07, 2005 4:30 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

I really have to push out for WMA here, 95% of my audio is stored in WMA
format, I have no intent on re-recording or changing file formats to suit
someone else, as it works on all my devices (inc the portable ones) and I am
very happy with the quality vs. file size.

When I'm not listening to the WMA files, then I'm listening to Internet
radio (club 977 - 80's radio) especially.

It may not be want you want to hear, however if you are developing a
replacement for the AT then as a bare minimum, it should do everything that
the current AT does, including WMA and Internet Radio

Thanks

Simon Walker

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
Sent: 05 March 2005 18:11
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
(Continue reading)

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Danny Rego | 6 Mar 2005 19:13

Re: Developing replacement for AT

That would be great.  Right now I use a combo of WMA lossless, and MP3.  The
main reason is both formats are compatible with all of my devices.  FLAC is
very interesting, but not practical at this point.

Anyways...if it supported WMA, I'd be right there.

Danny Rego

----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Richards" <glenn <at> SQUIRRELSOLUTIONS.CO.UK>
To: <AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM>
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 1:10 PM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

> Danny Rego wrote:
>
>> Sorry, but I wouldn't touch any device that doesn't support WMA.  Of
>> all of the lossy fle types, I find WMA to have the best quality.
>
> Have you tried OGG Vorbis? Better compression and smaller file size than
> MP3, the only reason I don't use it myself is because none of my
> hardware devices (AT and in-car MP3 CD players) will support it.
>
>> Aside from that, it is a very popular format, and I wouldn't want to
>> own a device that I have to pussyfoot around with to play my files.
>
> If there's a way of including WMA without headaches then we'll
> definitely look into it, on the grounds that we want to support as many
> filetypes as possible.
>
(Continue reading)

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Kimmo Suominen | 5 Mar 2005 22:14
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 06:10:45PM +0000, Glenn Richards wrote:
> Danny Rego wrote:
>
> >Sorry, but I wouldn't touch any device that doesn't support WMA.  Of
> >all of the lossy fle types, I find WMA to have the best quality.
>
> Have you tried OGG Vorbis? Better compression and smaller file size than
> MP3, the only reason I don't use it myself is because none of my
> hardware devices (AT and in-car MP3 CD players) will support it.

I think FLAC is a good idea, just because it is lossless.  I'm leaning
towards that as my "next generation" approach to ripping my CD's, as
I'm hoping it would be the "ultimate final version" of how to do this.

I'd probably generate 1 or 2 different sets of MP3 files from the FLAC
files: one set for "radio playback" with per-track normalization, and
another set for the iPod (per-album normalization).

Regards,
+ Kim
--
<A HREF="http://kimmo.suominen.com/">Kimmo Suominen</A>
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Joe Craig | 5 Mar 2005 17:33
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

 > I have not included WMA or internet radio support in the above spec

There are times I just want to listen to the radio!  I'd not want to
have to have a second device for that ...

Joe
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Glenn Richards | 5 Mar 2005 18:51
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Joe Craig wrote:

>> I have not included WMA or internet radio support in the above spec
> There are times I just want to listen to the radio!  I'd not want to
> have to have a second device for that ...

Noted - internet radio seems to be a popular feature of the AT. Not one
I ever use which is why I hadn't shortlisted it, but it should be fairly
trivial to implement.

--
  Glenn Richards                                     Tel: (01453) 845735
  Squirrel Solutions                 http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

  IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation
Permalink | Reply |
headers
Michael Wagner | 7 Mar 2005 04:47
Picon

Re: Developing replacement for AT

At 3/5/05 12:51 PM  Saturday, Glenn Richards wrote:
>Joe Craig wrote:
>
>>There are times I just want to listen to the radio!  I'd not want to
>>have to have a second device for that ...
>
>Noted - internet radio seems to be a popular feature of the AT. Not one
>I ever use which is why I hadn't shortlisted it, but it should be fairly
>trivial to implement.

I turn it on to keep the bird occupied (he likes to sing to virgin radio
groove out of Britain)
when we're out of the house.

Michael

http://home.cogeco.ca/~michaelwagner/personal-page.htm
"All I wanna do is have a little fun before I die" Sheryl Crow
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Oscar de la Guardia | 5 Mar 2005 15:43

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Ah, Glenn, this is music to our ears (pun intended). I would gladly pay a
premium for a radio-frequency remote control with an LCD screen that allows
one to manage playback a la ATTray.

Being able to plug in a USB2 external hard drive with my entire music on it
and share it across the network would be a big plus.

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 7:16 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a group of us
are looking at developing a replacement for the Audiotron. We're
currently building a prototype on an embedded development board, and
aiming to have the following features:

  * Support for MP3 (obviously), WAV, OGG and FLAC files
  * Extensible architecture allowing new features/formats to be added
  * USB interface for eg 802.11g interface
  * Similar UI, front panel controls/display

Additionally we're looking to possibly include the following options:

  * Ability to plug in a USB hard disk and CD-ROM. The unit would then
    function as "master", with other units on the same network operating
    as "slave". CD-ROM would enable ripping to FLAC format.
(Continue reading)

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phil Galli | 5 Mar 2005 15:14

Re: Developing replacement for AT

To Plug in to listen to and/or to load your Ipod when at home

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 7:16 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

Right... the project is a bit tentative at this stage, but a group of us
are looking at developing a replacement for the Audiotron. We're
currently building a prototype on an embedded development board, and
aiming to have the following features:

  * Support for MP3 (obviously), WAV, OGG and FLAC files
  * Extensible architecture allowing new features/formats to be added
  * USB interface for eg 802.11g interface
  * Similar UI, front panel controls/display

Additionally we're looking to possibly include the following options:

  * Ability to plug in a USB hard disk and CD-ROM. The unit would then
    function as "master", with other units on the same network operating
    as "slave". CD-ROM would enable ripping to FLAC format.

  * Web interface, as on the Audiotron

Currently we are experimenting with an embedded development board, and I
have a number of samples of a high quality Burr-Brown DAC with SPDIF
capability.
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Glenn Richards | 5 Mar 2005 15:42
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Re: Developing replacement for AT

phil Galli wrote:

> To Plug in to listen to and/or to load your Ipod when at home

Are the protocols to do this freely available?

--
  Glenn Richards                                     Tel: (01453) 845735
  Squirrel Solutions                 http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

  IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation
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phil Galli | 5 Mar 2005 16:43

Re: Developing replacement for AT

Don't know to what extent the protocols are available (free or for a
charge)but there are 3rd party products on the street that allow the Ipod to
plug in and play the ipod.  So at the very minimum the AP would act as a
broadcaster of Ipod based music.

If one 3rd party manufacturer can use it then all can use it (either free or
for a lic) with 10 million sold to date I would hate not to be part of the
3rd party vendor list.  The publicity would be worth the effort.

The 18 to 35 crowd all have Ipods....  They pay 99 to 300 for them and the
AT could be the high end appliance that brings the Ipod back to the
home.....

-----Original Message-----
From: Turtle Beach Audiotron User Forum
[mailto:AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM] On Behalf Of Glenn Richards
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 9:43 AM
To: AUDIOTRON <at> MAILLIST.VOYETRA.COM
Subject: Re: [AT] Developing replacement for AT

phil Galli wrote:

> To Plug in to listen to and/or to load your Ipod when at home

Are the protocols to do this freely available?

--
  Glenn Richards                                     Tel: (01453) 845735
  Squirrel Solutions                 http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/
(Continue reading)

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