headers
Adam Kennedy | 16 Apr 11:06

Perl::MinimumVersion

Hi folks

I'm presuming all of you have had a chance to read Rob's perl.com article.

http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2005/04/14/cpan_guidelines.html

I for one noticed a few interesting/odd points. :)

Firstly, I disagree with Rob's idea of excluding all operating systems 
until you get reports from users. Most of the time, 90% of people don't 
report. They just don't use the module.

Better in my mind to ship anyway, but make sure your tests relating to 
the filesystem are extra paranoid. That way modules just simply fail to 
install on unusual things like VMS.

But what I most wanted to speak about was minimum Perl versions for 
code, relating his Rob's "gotchas" stuff.

It should be possible (and it's been in the mental roadmap for a long 
time) to create with PPI a package that can tell you what the minimum 
version of Perl is to run any chunk of Perl code.

All the module would need to be would be a collection of PPI &wanted 
functions which search for a particular thing...

sub has_our_variables {
     $_[1]->isa('PPI::Statement::Variable')
     and $_[1]->type eq 'our';
}
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Rhesa | 16 Apr 12:43

Re: Perl::MinimumVersion

Adam Kennedy wrote:
 > Hi folks
 >
 > I'm presuming all of you have had a chance to read Rob's perl.com article.
 >
 > http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2005/04/14/cpan_guidelines.html
 >
 > I for one noticed a few interesting/odd points. :)

[...]

 > But what I most wanted to speak about was minimum Perl versions for
 > code, relating his Rob's "gotchas" stuff.
 >
 > It should be possible (and it's been in the mental roadmap for a long
 > time) to create with PPI a package that can tell you what the minimum
 > version of Perl is to run any chunk of Perl code.

That would be an excellent tool.
I just published my first module on CPAN, and this was my biggest issue. I _know_ it could be made to run on perl
5.004, with DBI 1.06, but 
I have no experience whatsoever with perls before 5.6.0. Knowing all the gotcha's would be great!

[snip]

 > Of course, there's some WAY more efficient algorithms I can see for
 > speeding up the searching, and you would also have to trace down into
 > included modules, but the above would get you a "naive minimum version",
 > which you would then compared against the same for all the needed modules.
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Adam Kennedy | 16 Apr 19:54

Re: Re: Perl::MinimumVersion

You pretty much have to work with the current versions of modules for 
most situations, as anyone using CPAN/CPANPLUS is going to have their 
modules updated. Or at least, that gets you to version 1.0 of the module.

You also have to ignore perl version stuff for anything that is core on 
whatever the current Perl is. The logic isn't too hard, and 
Module::CoreList is handy in this regard.

For starters, I'd just check what's on the current system. Most modules 
don't change their perl version deps very often.

Adam K

Rhesa wrote:
> Adam Kennedy wrote:
>  > Hi folks
>  >
>  > I'm presuming all of you have had a chance to read Rob's perl.com 
> article.
>  >
>  > http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2005/04/14/cpan_guidelines.html
>  >
>  > I for one noticed a few interesting/odd points. :)
> 
> [...]
> 
>  > But what I most wanted to speak about was minimum Perl versions for
>  > code, relating his Rob's "gotchas" stuff.
>  >
>  > It should be possible (and it's been in the mental roadmap for a long
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Rob Kinyon | 17 Apr 20:55
Picon
Gravatar

Re: Re: Perl::MinimumVersion

I would ignore the modules for now. Instead, focus on the language
features you use, like "our", 3-arg open, etc. Then, you can declare
"I am Perl#.#.# compliant.". Then, when someone wants to figure out if
a given module can be run on Perl #.#.#, they can look at the module
version they want and all the dependent modules, then take the largest
Perl version among them as the minimum version the module (and its
dependencies) will work on.

Remember - 1.0 could run on 5.004, 1.1 on 5.6.0, and 1.2 on 5.004. So,
it's like looking at

SELECT MAX(perl_version)
FROM some_master_table
WHERE module_version >= ?
AND module_name = ?

This can also allow the power user to choose to downgrade a given
module in order to support a lower Perl version. Now, I don't think
that feature will be used more than 10 times in the future history of
Perl, but it's nice to know it's in your back pocket ... if you need
it. :-)

Rob

On 4/16/05, Adam Kennedy <adam <at> phase-n.com> wrote:
> You pretty much have to work with the current versions of modules for
> most situations, as anyone using CPAN/CPANPLUS is going to have their
> modules updated. Or at least, that gets you to version 1.0 of the module.
> 
> You also have to ignore perl version stuff for anything that is core on
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Rob Kinyon | 19 Apr 20:00
Picon
Gravatar

Re: Re: Perl::MinimumVersion

We might want to get going with this ...

http://www.perlmonks.org/?node_id=449344

On 4/17/05, Rob Kinyon <rob.kinyon <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> I would ignore the modules for now. Instead, focus on the language
> features you use, like "our", 3-arg open, etc. Then, you can declare
> "I am Perl#.#.# compliant.". Then, when someone wants to figure out if
> a given module can be run on Perl #.#.#, they can look at the module
> version they want and all the dependent modules, then take the largest
> Perl version among them as the minimum version the module (and its
> dependencies) will work on.
> 
> Remember - 1.0 could run on 5.004, 1.1 on 5.6.0, and 1.2 on 5.004. So,
> it's like looking at
> 
> SELECT MAX(perl_version)
> FROM some_master_table
> WHERE module_version >= ?
> AND module_name = ?
> 
> This can also allow the power user to choose to downgrade a given
> module in order to support a lower Perl version. Now, I don't think
> that feature will be used more than 10 times in the future history of
> Perl, but it's nice to know it's in your back pocket ... if you need
> it. :-)
> 
> Rob
> 
> On 4/16/05, Adam Kennedy <adam <at> phase-n.com> wrote:
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Adam Kennedy | 20 Apr 02:29

Re: Re: Perl::MinimumVersion

I've got a basic first version (that ONLY checks for the use of 'our') 
done and sitting here. If anyone wants to help with some quick tests or 
something, I'll check it into the Parse::Perl sourceforce CVS.

Accounts are available for anyone that wants one.

Adam K

Rob Kinyon wrote:
> We might want to get going with this ...
> 
> http://www.perlmonks.org/?node_id=449344
> 
> On 4/17/05, Rob Kinyon <rob.kinyon <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>>I would ignore the modules for now. Instead, focus on the language
>>features you use, like "our", 3-arg open, etc. Then, you can declare
>>"I am Perl#.#.# compliant.". Then, when someone wants to figure out if
>>a given module can be run on Perl #.#.#, they can look at the module
>>version they want and all the dependent modules, then take the largest
>>Perl version among them as the minimum version the module (and its
>>dependencies) will work on.
>>
>>Remember - 1.0 could run on 5.004, 1.1 on 5.6.0, and 1.2 on 5.004. So,
>>it's like looking at
>>
>>SELECT MAX(perl_version)
>>FROM some_master_table
>>WHERE module_version >= ?
>>AND module_name = ?
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Adam Kennedy | 20 Apr 06:58

Re: Re: Perl::MinimumVersion

Okie dokey

I've just uploaded Perl::MinimumVersion 0.01 to PAUSE, it should be 
visible on CPAN in a few hours.

It works fine, and uses all the properly optimized algorithms, but 
doesn't check for very many things.

So if you know of any specific syntax things that require a perl 
version, you are more than welcome to cut and paste an existing check 
function and modify the 2 or 3 lines of code needed.

Then just post it to RT with the version for that check, and I'll merge 
whatever comes in.

Or if you have been added to the Parse::Perl soureforge project, just go 
straight ahead and add whatever functions you want.

Adam K

Adam Kennedy wrote:
> I've got a basic first version (that ONLY checks for the use of 'our') 
> done and sitting here. If anyone wants to help with some quick tests or 
> something, I'll check it into the Parse::Perl sourceforce CVS.
> 
> Accounts are available for anyone that wants one.
> 
> Adam K
> 
> Rob Kinyon wrote:
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Rob Kinyon | 26 Apr 15:27
Picon
Gravatar

Re: Re: Perl::MinimumVersion

Adam -

    castaway on PM just ran into an issue with Module::ScanDeps not
handling conditional requires within eval blocks correctly. This
sounds like a place for PPI (cause M::SD currently parses Perl itself,
very naively). But, I think Autrijus is a little busy right now. So,
just thought I'd propose it to you ...

Rob

On 4/20/05, Adam Kennedy <adam <at> phase-n.com> wrote:
> Okie dokey
> 
> I've just uploaded Perl::MinimumVersion 0.01 to PAUSE, it should be
> visible on CPAN in a few hours.
> 
> It works fine, and uses all the properly optimized algorithms, but
> doesn't check for very many things.
> 
> So if you know of any specific syntax things that require a perl
> version, you are more than welcome to cut and paste an existing check
> function and modify the 2 or 3 lines of code needed.
> 
> Then just post it to RT with the version for that check, and I'll merge
> whatever comes in.
> 
> Or if you have been added to the Parse::Perl soureforge project, just go
> straight ahead and add whatever functions you want.
> 
> Adam K
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |
headers
Adam Kennedy | 27 Apr 04:55

Re: Re: Perl::MinimumVersion

Yep, it is.

Ultimately, I think pretty much the entire Module:: namespace should end 
up somewhat related to PPI eventually. But doing so it getting a bit out 
of my league.

I'm also very busy for almost the entire period up until OSCON, so at 
some point someone else is going to need to step up to help with these 
PPI ports of the existing modules. :)

Adam K

Rob Kinyon wrote:
> Adam -
> 
>     castaway on PM just ran into an issue with Module::ScanDeps not
> handling conditional requires within eval blocks correctly. This
> sounds like a place for PPI (cause M::SD currently parses Perl itself,
> very naively). But, I think Autrijus is a little busy right now. So,
> just thought I'd propose it to you ...
> 
> Rob
> 
> On 4/20/05, Adam Kennedy <adam <at> phase-n.com> wrote:
> 
>>Okie dokey
>>
>>I've just uploaded Perl::MinimumVersion 0.01 to PAUSE, it should be
>>visible on CPAN in a few hours.
>>
(Continue reading)

Permalink | Reply |

Gmane