Gentoo Linux developer list

Timothy Redaelli | 21 Feb 14:32

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[RFC] custom-cflags global USE

What do you think about custom-cflags global USE?

app-emulation/xen-tools:custom-cflags - Use CFLAGS from /etc/make.conf
rather than the default Xen CFLAGS (not supported)
app-emulation/xen:custom-cflags - Use CFLAGS from /etc/make.conf rather
than the default Xen CFLAGS (not supported)
games-emulation/zsnes:custom-cflags - Enables custom cflags (not supported)
media-video/mplayer:custom-cflags - Enables custom cflags (not supported)
net-im/gaim:custom-cflags - Disables stripping of "unsafe C[XX]FLAGS"
sys-boot/grub:custom-cflags - Enables custom cflags (not supported)

It has (almost) the same meaning on all packages

--

-- 
Timothy `Drizzt` Redaelli - http://dev.gentoo.org/~drizzt/
FreeSBIE Developer, Gentoo Developer, GUFI Staff
There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and UNIX.
We don't believe this to be a coincidence.      -- Jeremy S. Anderson

Carsten Lohrke | 23 Feb 01:40

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

*

On Mittwoch, 21. Februar 2007, Timothy Redaelli wrote:
> What do you think about custom-cflags global USE?

I'd be pleased to see the flag removed. I think it's up to the maintainers, if 
they accept bug reports due to custom cflags, even though upstream doesn't or 
restrict them for other reasons. If people care so much about it, there's 
always your local overlay.

And I'd be fond of having all the -ffast-math filtering ripped out of the tree 
as well.

Carsten

Ryan Hill | 25 Feb 16:29

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

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Carsten Lohrke wrote:

> And I'd be fond of having all the -ffast-math filtering ripped out of the tree 
> as well.

Please include -ftree-vectorize and -ftree-loop-linear along with that.
 I've yet to see a GCC release where they work correctly, including 4.2.

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Chris Gianelloni | 23 Feb 09:48

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

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On Fri, 2007-02-23 at 01:40 +0100, Carsten Lohrke wrote:
> And I'd be fond of having all the -ffast-math filtering ripped out of the tree 
> as well.

Except some things really do not compile with it enabled.  Now, if
you're meaning you'd prefer patch every compilation failure using
-ffast-math instead, then I'd say go for it.  Patches are always a
better solution than workarounds.

--

-- 
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering Strategic Lead
Alpha/AMD64/x86 Architecture Teams
Games Developer/Council Member/Foundation Trustee
Gentoo Foundation

Paul de Vrieze | 24 Feb 16:01

X-Face

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

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On Friday 23 February 2007, Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> On Fri, 2007-02-23 at 01:40 +0100, Carsten Lohrke wrote:
> > And I'd be fond of having all the -ffast-math filtering ripped out of the
> > tree as well.
>
> Except some things really do not compile with it enabled.  Now, if
> you're meaning you'd prefer patch every compilation failure using
> -ffast-math instead, then I'd say go for it.  Patches are always a
> better solution than workarounds.

Except that software not working with -ffast-math is not in the wrong at all. 
It is like specifying -fno-rtti for a c++ program. If rtti is not used, this 
is fine. It is a part of the standard however, and this makes the compiler 
not except all standard-compliant code. These options are there to enable 
better code generation when it is known that the named features are not 
needed. They should never be globally enabled.

Paul

--

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Paul de Vrieze
Gentoo Developer
Mail: pauldv <at> gentoo.org
Homepage: http://www.devrieze.net

Carsten Lohrke | 23 Feb 14:20

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

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On Freitag, 23. Februar 2007, Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> Except some things really do not compile with it enabled.  Now, if
> you're meaning you'd prefer patch every compilation failure using
> -ffast-math instead, then I'd say go for it.  Patches are always a
> better solution than workarounds.

I mean that having this flag set globally is plain stupid and everyone doing 
so deserves to deal with the consequences. Mike pointed out why.

Carsten

Mike Frysinger | 23 Feb 12:41

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

*

On Friday 23 February 2007, Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> On Fri, 2007-02-23 at 01:40 +0100, Carsten Lohrke wrote:
> > And I'd be fond of having all the -ffast-math filtering ripped out of the
> > tree as well.
>
> Except some things really do not compile with it enabled.  Now, if
> you're meaning you'd prefer patch every compilation failure using
> -ffast-math instead, then I'd say go for it.  Patches are always a
> better solution than workarounds.

filtering encourages users to continue to put -ffast-math into their global 
CFLAGS ... this is just plain wrong

ignoring compile issues, fast math can break runtime code that actually 
requires the IEEE compliant behavior ... the only people who know 
whether -ffast-math is safe are the upstream maintainers ... leave using the 
flag to them
-mike

Ciaran McCreesh | 21 Feb 18:12

Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 14:32:56 +0100 Timothy Redaelli <drizzt <at> gentoo.org>
wrote:
| What do you think about custom-cflags global USE?

I think it encourages policy violations.

http://devmanual.gentoo.org/general-concepts/user-environment/index.html

--

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh
Mail                                : ciaranm at ciaranm.org
Web                                 : http://ciaranm.org/
Paludis, the secure package manager : http://paludis.pioto.org/

Timothy Redaelli | 21 Feb 18:25

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

*

Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 14:32:56 +0100 Timothy Redaelli <drizzt <at> gentoo.org>
> wrote:
> | What do you think about custom-cflags global USE?
> 
> I think it encourages policy violations.
> 
> http://devmanual.gentoo.org/general-concepts/user-environment/index.html

I know the policy, but sometimes upstream does not want user CFLAGS,
zsnes developers will remove support for Gentoo hosts from their bug
reports if i remove custom-cflags use and also mplayer.

Since some exceptions exists, i think we can globalize the USE without
any problem (with local USE the problem is the same, anyone can create a
port with custom-cflags local USE)

--

-- 
Timothy `Drizzt` Redaelli - http://dev.gentoo.org/~drizzt/
FreeSBIE Developer, Gentoo Developer, GUFI Staff
There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and UNIX.
We don't believe this to be a coincidence.      -- Jeremy S. Anderson

Danny van Dyk | 21 Feb 18:46

X-Face

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

Am Mittwoch, 21. Februar 2007 18:25 schrieb Timothy Redaelli:
*

> Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 14:32:56 +0100 Timothy Redaelli
> > <drizzt <at> gentoo.org>
> >
> > wrote:
> > | What do you think about custom-cflags global USE?
> >
> > I think it encourages policy violations.
> >
> > http://devmanual.gentoo.org/general-concepts/user-environment/index
> >.html
>
> I know the policy, but sometimes upstream does not want user CFLAGS,
> zsnes developers will remove support for Gentoo hosts from their bug
> reports if i remove custom-cflags use and also mplayer.

What about making custom-cflags default in the base profile?

Danny
-- 
Danny van Dyk <kugelfang <at> gentoo.org>
Gentoo/AMD64 Project, Gentoo Scientific Project
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Jakub Moc | 21 Feb 18:53

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

Danny van Dyk napsal(a):
*

> What about making custom-cflags default in the base profile?

Uhm? Maybe re-read the description of the flags? It's unsupported and
breaks stuff, that's why the use flag exists...

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 Jakub Moc
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Ciaran McCreesh | 21 Feb 19:32

Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

*

On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 18:53:47 +0100 Jakub Moc <jakub <at> gentoo.org> wrote:
| Danny van Dyk napsal(a):
| > What about making custom-cflags default in the base profile?
| 
| Uhm? Maybe re-read the description of the flags? It's unsupported and
| breaks stuff, that's why the use flag exists...

And not using user CFLAGS is unsupported and breaks things horribly on
several archs.

--

-- 
Ciaran McCreesh
Mail                                : ciaranm at ciaranm.org
Web                                 : http://ciaranm.org/
Paludis, the secure package manager : http://paludis.pioto.org/

Luca Barbato | 21 Feb 21:30

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Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

*

Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 18:53:47 +0100 Jakub Moc <jakub <at> gentoo.org> wrote:
> | Danny van Dyk napsal(a):
> | > What about making custom-cflags default in the base profile?
> | 
> | Uhm? Maybe re-read the description of the flags? It's unsupported and
> | breaks stuff, that's why the use flag exists...
> 
> And not using user CFLAGS is unsupported and breaks things horribly on
> several archs.
> 

Upstream is willing to heard good bug reports about it possibly with
patches to improve the support on such arches =)

lu

-- 

Luca Barbato

Gentoo/linux Gentoo/PPC
http://dev.gentoo.org/~lu_zero

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gentoo-dev <at> gentoo.org mailing list

Michael Sterrett -Mr. Bones.- | 21 Feb 18:54

Re: [RFC] custom-cflags global USE

How about we just leave them as local use flags and move on?  global
vs. local is more then just about number of packages using the flag.
It has more to do with, "Is this flag globally useful and relevant."
So far, I haven't seen a recently suggest local use flag that cries out
to be made global.

Michael Sterrett
   -Mr. Bones.-
mr_bones_ <at> gentoo.org

On Wed, 21 Feb 2007, Danny van Dyk wrote:

*

> Am Mittwoch, 21. Februar 2007 18:25 schrieb Timothy Redaelli:
>> Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
>>> On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 14:32:56 +0100 Timothy Redaelli
>>> <drizzt <at> gentoo.org>
>>>
>>> wrote:
>>> | What do you think about custom-cflags global USE?
>>>
>>> I think it encourages policy violations.
>>>
>>> http://devmanual.gentoo.org/general-concepts/user-environment/index
>>> .html
>>
>> I know the policy, but sometimes upstream does not want user CFLAGS,
>> zsnes developers will remove support for Gentoo hosts from their bug
>> reports if i remove custom-cflags use and also mplayer.
>
> What about making custom-cflags default in the base profile?
>
> Danny
> -- 
> Danny van Dyk <kugelfang <at> gentoo.org>
> Gentoo/AMD64 Project, Gentoo Scientific Project
> -- 
> gentoo-dev <at> gentoo.org mailing list
>
>
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gentoo-dev <at> gentoo.org mailing list

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