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david | 27 Aug 2012 21:51
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Question on Character Encoding- a puzzlement

Some background:  I coordinate a mailing list for a private club.
Mailing is done by an email service provider. Several members using
Outlook Express have reported routinely getting  Â Â Â Â generally
where there were spaces in messages. To my knowledge that is an
encoding mismatch. Members using other email clients haven't reported
the problem. So, okay OE is old and I can't fix it, but I did attempt to
resend the message to myself using a different character set. (The
original appears to be 7bitASCII). Now, when I resend with UTF-8, the
message arrives in OE just fine. Problem identified.

Okay, now to my puzzlement.. When I click the message I redirected from
my sent folder and click reEdit, the message opens in compose window
with all the  Â Â Â Â  there  -  but when I sent the message they
weren't there. From curiosity, I send this message also. When it
appears in inbox, those characters appear as nbsp; (not   - just
nbsp;) A puzzlement to me. Any explanation on what I'm seeing? I don't
see this as a problem, but such things puzzle me. Thanks for any insight.
david 


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Michael Levy | 27 Aug 2012 22:19
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Re: Question on Character Encoding- a puzzlement

On Mon, 27 Aug 2012 15:51:43 -0400 david wrote:

snip...
If these are HTML messages, problem is caused by Internet Explorer which is the HTML viewer Becky uses.

Michael

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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david | 28 Aug 2012 21:54
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Re: Question on Character Encoding- a puzzlement


--- In beckymail@..., Michael Levy <mjklevy <at> ...> wrote:
>
> On Mon, 27 Aug 2012 15:51:43 -0400 david wrote:
> 
> snip...
> If these are HTML messages, problem is caused by Internet Explorer which is the HTML viewer Becky uses.
> 
> 
> Michael
> 
Okay, I'll let it pass as another idiosyncrasy, but it seemed 
strange that I could 

- receive a proper HTML message with no errors
- redirect the message and it is received with no errors
- but when I reedit the redirected message it's full of 
trash. 
Oh, well...  weird. thanks. 
david 

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Michael Levy | 29 Aug 2012 01:18
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Re: Question on Character Encoding- a puzzlement

On Tue, 28 Aug 2012 19:54:52 -0000 david wrote:

>  --- In
<mailto:beckymail%40yahoogroups.com>beckymail@...,
Michael Levy <mjklevy <at> ...> wrote:
>  >
>  > On Mon, 27 Aug 2012 15:51:43 -0400 david wrote:
>  > 
>  > snip...
>  > If these are HTML messages, problem is caused by Internet Explorer which is the HTML viewer Becky uses.
>  > 
>  > 
>  > Michael
>  > 
>  Okay, I'll let it pass as another idiosyncrasy, but it seemed 
>  strange that I could 

Not strange at all when you understand what is going on in each case.
Let me try and see if I can finally get this HTML in Becky situation
across to you.
Let's start with the 'fact' that Becky is not designed with any integrated
HTML capability. A link to the IE html engine has been added to satisfy
those users who wanted to view HTML mail. Now that engine can write HTML
even though it is not perfect. For writing more accurate HTML users
should use an external HTML editor.
SO....
>  - receive a proper HTML message with no errors
Because they are absent in the sent HTML message
>  - redirect the message and it is received with no errors
as above redirection does nothing to the content of the html message
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david | 29 Aug 2012 13:55
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Re: Question on Character Encoding- a puzzlement


--- In beckymail@..., Michael Levy <mjklevy <at> ...> wrote:
>..<snip>....
> Ah now you can create those errors by using the IE engine to edit. Note
> if the font set in IE (outside of Becky) is not the same as the font in
> the message you will have the start of a problem.
> Have you tried to do this by setting Becky to use an external html
> capable editor??
> 
> Why am I having such a hard time over the years getting the point across
> that Becky uses Internet Explorer html driver for viewing and writing
> HTML which is not a perfect version of an HTML writing program???
> 
> I hope I have made some headway in educating you today......  ;)
> 

okay, I'm gettin' smarter...  but it's not intuitive. Your explanation, plus Steven's comment, tie
together and my observation that the font/character set was a component is reassuring. What you
described is exactly what happened. regards,
david 

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Steven P. Venti | 27 Aug 2012 23:42
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Re: Question on Character Encoding- a puzzlement

david <dskirk@...> wrote:
> A puzzlement to me. Any explanation on what I'm seeing? I don't
> see this as a problem, but such things puzzle me.

This might not provide any insight into your problem, but for what it is worth,
there are several aspects of Becky that are not 100% Unicode compliant.

I use the English version of Becky on Win7 Ultimate. Previously, I had the
language for non-Unicode programs set to Japanese and had absolutely no
problems. I recently had an issue with a voice recognition program, however,
that required me to change the language for non-Unicode programs to English,
and this had considerable impact on Becky's behavior.

The two biggest issues are that (1) subject lines in Unicode (Japanese) do not
display properly the Message List pane and (2) I can no longer open or save
attachments when there are Unicode (Japanese) characters in the file name.

I have no idea why this is happening, but it sounds like your problem is due
to a similar inconsistency in the way Becky processes character encodings.

HTH

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   Mail: spventi@...
   A Bizarre Reunion by Ryunosuke Akutagawa
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