gmane.org.misc.open-knowledge-foundation.general

Jonathan Gray | 17 Jun 01:28

Export Controls and OKD § 7.

I was just adding a package [1] to CKAN and was looking through its
Terms and Conditions to check its assertion that it is an 'open database'.

I discovered a section on 'Jurisdictional Issues', which reads as follows:

"The BIOCYC DATABASES are controlled by SRI from its offices within the
State of California. SRI and its Licensors make no representation that
the BIOCYC DATABASES are appropriate or available for use in other
locations.  Those who choose to access the BIOCYC DATABASES from other
locations do so at their own initiative and are responsible for
compliance with local laws, if and to the extent local laws are
applicable.  The BIOCYC DATABASES are further subject to United States
export controls.  The BIOCYC DATABASES may not be installed, downloaded
or otherwise exported or reexported (i) into (or to a national or
resident of) any country as to which the U.S. has embargoed goods; or
(ii) to anyone on the U.S. Treasury Department's list of Specialty
Designated Nationals or the U.S. Commerce Department's Table of Deny
Orders.  By installing, downloading or using the BIOCYC DATABASES, you
represent and warrant that you are not located in, under the control of,
or a national or resident of any such country on any such list." [2]

This doesn't seem compatible with point 7 of the OKD, "No Discrimination
Against Persons or Groups".

Any thoughts?

I would be interested to find out more about what kinds of knowledge is
usually subject to export controls (in the US and elsewhere) if anyone has
any useful tips.

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Rufus Pollock | 23 Jun 16:57

Re: Export Controls and OKD § 7.

On 17/06/08 00:32, Jonathan Gray wrote:
> I was just adding a package [1] to CKAN and was looking through its
> Terms and Conditions to check its assertion that it is an 'open database'.
> 
> I discovered a section on 'Jurisdictional Issues', which reads as follows:
> 
> "The BIOCYC DATABASES are controlled by SRI from its offices within the
> State of California. SRI and its Licensors make no representation that
> the BIOCYC DATABASES are appropriate or available for use in other
> locations.  Those who choose to access the BIOCYC DATABASES from other
> locations do so at their own initiative and are responsible for
> compliance with local laws, if and to the extent local laws are
> applicable.  The BIOCYC DATABASES are further subject to United States
> export controls.  The BIOCYC DATABASES may not be installed, downloaded
> or otherwise exported or reexported (i) into (or to a national or
> resident of) any country as to which the U.S. has embargoed goods; or
> (ii) to anyone on the U.S. Treasury Department's list of Specialty
> Designated Nationals or the U.S. Commerce Department's Table of Deny
> Orders.  By installing, downloading or using the BIOCYC DATABASES, you
> represent and warrant that you are not located in, under the control of,
> or a national or resident of any such country on any such list." [2]
> 
> This doesn't seem compatible with point 7 of the OKD, "No Discrimination
> Against Persons or Groups".
> 
> Any thoughts?

I think you are right that this violates item 7. I also think this issue 
has (frequently?) come up in the F/OSS world, especially in relation to 
cryptography stuff (which I think was considered of potential military

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Luis Villa | 23 Jun 17:09

Re: Export Controls and OKD § 7.

On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 7:57 AM, Rufus Pollock <rufus.pollock@...> wrote:
> On 17/06/08 00:32, Jonathan Gray wrote:
>> I was just adding a package [1] to CKAN and was looking through its
>> Terms and Conditions to check its assertion that it is an 'open database'.
>>
>> I discovered a section on 'Jurisdictional Issues', which reads as follows:
>>
>> "The BIOCYC DATABASES are controlled by SRI from its offices within the
>> State of California. SRI and its Licensors make no representation that
>> the BIOCYC DATABASES are appropriate or available for use in other
>> locations.  Those who choose to access the BIOCYC DATABASES from other
>> locations do so at their own initiative and are responsible for
>> compliance with local laws, if and to the extent local laws are
>> applicable.  The BIOCYC DATABASES are further subject to United States
>> export controls.  The BIOCYC DATABASES may not be installed, downloaded
>> or otherwise exported or reexported (i) into (or to a national or
>> resident of) any country as to which the U.S. has embargoed goods; or
>> (ii) to anyone on the U.S. Treasury Department's list of Specialty
>> Designated Nationals or the U.S. Commerce Department's Table of Deny
>> Orders.  By installing, downloading or using the BIOCYC DATABASES, you
>> represent and warrant that you are not located in, under the control of,
>> or a national or resident of any such country on any such list." [2]
>>
>> This doesn't seem compatible with point 7 of the OKD, "No Discrimination
>> Against Persons or Groups".
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>
> I think you are right that this violates item 7. I also think this issue
> has (frequently?) come up in the F/OSS world, especially in relation to

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Benj. Mako Hill | 24 Jun 22:00

Re: Export Controls and OKD § 7.

<quote who="Luis Villa" date="Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 08:09:50AM -0700">
> Generally speaking in the FOSS context we don't put it in the
> licenses, we leave it up to the distributors. Since the distributors
> have no obligation to distribute to everyone- just to distribute
> source to whoever *they choose* to distribute binaries to- there is
> considered to be no problem.

There are licenses that are otherwise free but include a statement that
states or implies users must obey export regulations and obtain
permission or violate the license. These are definitely problematic and
(IMHO) probably non-free.

> That said, I don't know what OSI has said about more explicit export
> control clauses in licenses. The wise and aged wordsmiths there might
> have found a way around it, don't know.

The FSF has had conversations about this over the last few months.
Discussion between parties and within the FSF is still ongoing. In any
case, I suspect it's far too focused on the language of specific
licenses to be of any more help to the general issue.

Regards,
Mako

--

-- 
Benjamin Mako Hill
mako@...
http://mako.cc/

Creativity can be a social contribution, but only in so far

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