Discussion and development coordinating the integration of OpenStreetMap and other free map sources into Wikimedia projects ()

FR Lopez Hugo | 16 Feb 2012 18:17

Re: Maps-l Digest, Vol 28, Issue 4

Dear all,

Thanks for your large efforts to allow GIS maps **display** into wikipedia's articles.

There is also an on going efforts to allow GIS maps **edition & storage** for wikipedia's usage, and so for encyclopedic maps.

GIS EDITING advancement :

Sharemap.org took the initiative to create a GoogleMap-like for Wikipedia. A system (Sharemap.org) where wiki mapmakers can create, edit, store their encyclopedic maps. This in a centralized GIS way with standardized icons, designed for Wikipedia. Maps such the "Battle of Watterloo", "Birth rate in the US", "Japanese topography", etc will be possible. Translate a map will only involve the translation of the labels layers making translations easier (= more languages) compare to commons. The GIS maps will be downloadable in SVG/JPEG format too. This stage is already largely working.

GIS EDITING need SUPPORT : for inclusion in wikipedia

Secondly, the project wish to allow inclusion of its maps within wikipedia articles. Your knowledge will be appreciate. Languages used being :

1. ActionScript 3 with Flex framework for visual editor

2. Java for site management and map and content repository

3. JavaScript for SVG rendering code

Jakub, the programmer, may tell you more if interested. (I'm a map maker).

GIS EDITING need SUPPORT : to connect to the WM foundation :

Sharemap.org is also looking for contacts, programmers, scholarships to solidify or actively support this project and associate it with the wikimedia foundation.

The project is opensource (CC-BY-SA 3.0), willfully a wikipedia friendly license.

Please, who is interested for more information ? Who may I contact for further collaboration with Wikipedia/Media ?

Best wishes !

Hugo Lopez

<div>
<div>
<div>Dear all,</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Thanks for your large efforts to allow GIS maps **display** into wikipedia's articles.</div>
<div>There is also an on going efforts to allow GIS maps **edition &amp; storage** &nbsp;for wikipedia's usage, and so for encyclopedic maps.&nbsp;</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>GIS EDITING advancement&nbsp;:</div>
<div>Sharemap.org took the initiative to create a GoogleMap-like for Wikipedia. A system (Sharemap.org) where wiki mapmakers can create, edit, store their encyclopedic maps.&nbsp;This in a centralized GIS way with standardized icons, designed for Wikipedia. Maps such the "Battle of Watterloo", "Birth rate in the US", "Japanese topography", etc will be possible. Translate a map will only involve the translation of the labels layers making translations easier (= more languages) compare to commons. The GIS maps will be downloadable in SVG/JPEG format too. This stage is already largely working.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>GIS EDITING need SUPPORT : for inclusion in wikipedia</div>
<div>
<div>Secondly, the project wish to allow inclusion of its maps within wikipedia articles. Your knowledge will be appreciate.&nbsp;Languages used being :</div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote class="webkit-indent-blockquote">
<div><div>
<div>1. ActionScript 3 with Flex framework for visual editor</div>
</div></div>
<div><div><div>2. Java for site management and map and content repository</div></div></div>
<div><div>
<div>3. JavaScript for SVG rendering code</div>
</div></div>
</blockquote>Jakub, the programmer, may tell you more if interested. (I'm a map maker).<br><div>
<div><br></div>
<div>GIS EDITING need SUPPORT :&nbsp;to connect to the WM foundation :&nbsp;</div>
<div>Sharemap.org is also looking for&nbsp;contacts, programmers, scholarships to solidify or actively support this project and associate it with the wikimedia foundation.&nbsp;</div>
<div>The project is opensource (CC-BY-SA 3.0), willfully a wikipedia friendly license.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Please, who is interested for more information ? Who may I contact for further collaboration with Wikipedia/Media ?</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Best wishes !</div>
<div>--</div>
<div>Hugo Lopez</div>
<div><br></div>
</div>
</div>

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Platonides | 18 Feb 2012 18:00

Re: Maps-l Digest, Vol 28, Issue 4

On 16/02/12 18:17, FR Lopez Hugo wrote:
> Dear all,
> 
> Thanks for your large efforts to allow GIS maps **display** into
> wikipedia's articles.
> There is also an on going efforts to allow GIS maps **edition &
> storage**  for wikipedia's usage, and so for encyclopedic maps. 
> 
(...)
> GIS EDITING need SUPPORT : for inclusion in wikipedia
> Secondly, the project wish to allow inclusion of its maps within
> wikipedia articles. Your knowledge will be appreciate. Languages used
> being :
> 
>     1. *ActionScript 3* with Flex framework for visual editor
>     2. *Java* for site management and map and content repository
>     3. *JavaScript* for SVG rendering code
> 
> Jakub, the programmer, may tell you more if interested. (I'm a map maker).

You are requiring Flash and Java support?
You won't get much support for embedding that into Wikipedia (specially
Flash, does it at least work with eg. Gnash?).

headers

ShareMap | 19 Feb 2012 00:26

Re: Maps-l Digest, Vol 28, Issue 4

W dniu 2/18/12 6:00 PM, Platonides pisze:
> You are requiring Flash and Java support?
> You won't get much support for embedding that into Wikipedia (specially
> Flash, does it at least work with eg. Gnash?).
Thanks Platonides, you asked very good question.

Wikipedia long standing policy was to use content only in open formats. 
Even if Flex framework is now fully open source (Apache) then Flash 
Runtime is still owned by Adobe.

But this is not an issue - ShareMap goal is not to integrate any Java or 
Flash content to wikipedia.

With ShareMap user can create interactive maps in SVG format. SVG file 
that is fully open format compatible with HTML5 and natively supported 
by all modern browsers (Firefox, Chrome, Safari, Opera, Internet 
Explorer). Animated SVG files are supported on both desktops and mobile 
devices (Smartphones, Tablets).

At current moment it is possible to add animated SVG maps to Wikimedia. 
But like all SVG files they are presented on article in rendered form as 
PNG without any interactivity. To view fully functional version user has 
to click once to go to Wiki Commons page and click again to view SVG in 
browser. It is not a surprise that almost nobody do that.

Rendering SVG to PNG made sense 5 years ago when browser does not 
supports natively SVG. But as I mentioned before today it is not longer 
problem <svg> tag allows direct embedding SVG content inside HTML web pages.

How author can currently add animation to article ... by adding animated 
GIF - terrible.

One word about ShareMap map designer - current editor is created with 
Flash 10 and Flex framework, ShareMap team does not think that it is 
feasible  to convert project to older version of flash (that can be run 
with Gnash) or to HTML5 app. About year ago same discussion about 
technology was performed within Open Street Map project - their web map 
editor Potlach was earlier designed in old Flash and it was possible to 
run it in Gnash. But the development was reached limits of old Flash and 
they decided to use use Flex inside Potlach 2. The dillemma was very 
simple - create map web editor that requires proprietary Adobe Flash 
Player or don't create anyone [1][2]. But editor is important for 500 
Wikipedia map creators not 5000000 map consumers.

In short summary about ShareMap technologies:
1. Map design is performed in Flash application
2. Map embedding as interactive SVG (or in future maybe HTML5 Canvas 
with WebGL 3D support).

What we need from Wikipedia Community:
1. Quick adaptation of direct SVG embedding inside Wikipedia (MediaWiki 
engine)
2. Help from volunteers in testing, evaluating and development.
3. Help with infrastructure, currently we are working on servers that we 
can you use for Creative Commons things, because we use them also for 
commercial project, but I think that in future it may be feasible to run 
special instance of ShareMap environment on Wikimedia infrastructure and 
dedicated for creation map for wikipedia.

Regards and waiting for further questions
J.K.

[1]http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Potlatch
[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Potlatch_2

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Samuel Klein | 20 Feb 2012 06:20

Re: Maps-l Digest, Vol 28, Issue 4

This is a very, very cool project.

Thank you for sharing, Hugo and Jakub.

On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 6:26 PM, ShareMap <contact@...> wrote:

> 2. Map embedding as interactive SVG (or in future maybe HTML5 Canvas with
> WebGL 3D support).

This is how you do it at sharemap.org now?
Do you have examples of different implementations of this?

> What we need from Wikipedia Community:
> 1. Quick adaptation of direct SVG embedding inside Wikipedia (MediaWiki
> engine)
> 2. Help from volunteers in testing, evaluating and development.
< 3. Help with infrastructure ... to run special instance of ShareMap
environment
> on Wikimedia infrastructure and dedicated for creation [of] map for wikipedia.

Can you set up a wiki page that describes in a bit mor detail what
each of these would involve?

1. What is still needed here?
2. Where can volunteers sign up?
3. What might the system requirements be?

You also mentioned wanting support for scholarships or internships for
people to help work on the project.
You can submit a specific proposal for this or for infrastructure, for
grant funding from the Wikimedia Foundation:

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants

You may also be able to get support directly from local Wikimedia
chapters, though the process there is not as clear (just write to them
individually).  The largest chapter is Wikimedia Deutschland
(wikimedia.de), where there is a very active mapping community.

Sam.

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Platonides | 21 Feb 2012 00:12

Re: Maps-l Digest, Vol 28, Issue 4

On 20/02/12 06:20, Samuel Klein wrote:
> This is a very, very cool project.
> 
> Thank you for sharing, Hugo and Jakub.
> 
> 
> On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 6:26 PM, ShareMap <contact@...> wrote:
> 
>> 2. Map embedding as interactive SVG (or in future maybe HTML5 Canvas with
>> WebGL 3D support).
> 
> This is how you do it at sharemap.org now?
> Do you have examples of different implementations of this?

No. They are showing the content in Flash by default (with no fallback
in case it isn't available, even).

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ShareMap | 21 Feb 2012 00:58

Re: Maps-l Digest, Vol 28, Issue 4

Thanks Samuel for comments,
currently ShareMap maps can be viewed in 3 ways

1. As interactive map (using flash), user can click markers view 
images/videos
2. As static SVG file (using SVG rendition built in modern browser)
3. As static JPEG (that can be viewed on virtually any graphic browser)

That the current state of published version, in our internal development 
version we are evaluating other map rendition scenarios - both HTML5 
compliant, one of them may be potential rendition engine for Wikipedia

1. HTML5 interactive rendition (similar to Google Maps, OpenLayers)

We are evaluation two ways of implementation - Leaflet (good 
compatibility, possible performance problems, more lightweight than 
OpenLayers) and creating custom Canvas based component (worst 
compatibility, better performance)

-PROS
* Will work flawlessly on mobile devices
* Technological purity (important in Wikipedia integration)
* Possibility of using 3D in future using WebGL (already possible in flash)

-CONS
* Not very important on desktop, because 97% of users has Flash (based 
on site first visit statistics) - in this case limited time of ShareMap 
developers can be spend in better way
* Compatibility problem of canvas solution
* Worst performance with large datasets of vector data than Flash

2. Interactive SVG renditions that can be flawlessly embedded inside 
normal HTML page

-PROS
* Possibility of creating interactive animated maps that does not have 
any external dependencies. Atomic files can be saved on disk, stored at 
Wiki Commons. User only need modern browser to view i older browser SVG 
plugin can be installed
* User can modify map without using ShareMap - just by editing 
JavaScript and shapes inside SVG

-CONS
* Not very good adoption of SVG in browsers on older Android mobile 
devices (smaller problem on Android 3/4)
* Embedding video in SVG is not straightforward
* In some scenarios performance problem

I hope that in two weeks we will be able to show some mock up 
demonstration of integration ShareMap with sample Wikipedia article. I 
be very happy to receive feedback from members of this mailing list.

In the meanwhile ShareMap team is working on implementing last missing 
features in ShareMap editor (which is in Flash and we have no plans to 
move it to other technology)

1. Map animation with dates time line (for historical mapping)

2. Map calibration mechanism to trace Public Domain raster maps (ie. 
topographic and historical) (this modules utilizes GDAL library server side)

3. Tool for designing interactive map boxes - legend, info bubbles etc.

Regards
J.K.

W dniu 2/20/12 6:20 AM, Samuel Klein pisze:
> This is a very, very cool project.
>
> Thank you for sharing, Hugo and Jakub.
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 6:26 PM, ShareMap<contact@...>  wrote:
>
>> 2. Map embedding as interactive SVG (or in future maybe HTML5 Canvas with
>> WebGL 3D support).
> This is how you do it at sharemap.org now?
> Do you have examples of different implementations of this?
>
>> What we need from Wikipedia Community:
>> 1. Quick adaptation of direct SVG embedding inside Wikipedia (MediaWiki
>> engine)
>> 2. Help from volunteers in testing, evaluating and development.
> <  3. Help with infrastructure ... to run special instance of ShareMap
> environment
>> on Wikimedia infrastructure and dedicated for creation [of] map for wikipedia.
> Can you set up a wiki page that describes in a bit mor detail what
> each of these would involve?
>
> 1. What is still needed here?
> 2. Where can volunteers sign up?
> 3. What might the system requirements be?
>
> You also mentioned wanting support for scholarships or internships for
> people to help work on the project.
> You can submit a specific proposal for this or for infrastructure, for
> grant funding from the Wikimedia Foundation:
>
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants
>
> You may also be able to get support directly from local Wikimedia
> chapters, though the process there is not as clear (just write to them
> individually).  The largest chapter is Wikimedia Deutschland
> (wikimedia.de), where there is a very active mapping community.
>
> Sam.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Maps-l mailing list
> Maps-l@...
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/maps-l